The Ukraine Situation

[steamy]

Isn't strange in 1939 we waged war against a far-right Nazi power and with the help of our Russian allies we overcame them in 1945. How the tables have turned we are now supporting a far-right governed country with learnings towards Nazism fighting against our old allies who helped us stamp out Nazism in 1945.

Russia was never on anyones side but their own during WWII and then look what happened post war.

As for a far-right Ukraine. You really need to read up on what you’re posting.

Russia was always at war with the Nazi's (Probably before Britain was) so If? there were or even still are factions of Nazi's within Ukraine - kind of throws some light on possibly why Putin did what he did.

ah yeah, his neo Nazi's are OK though, good skins

[Vulcanone]

So Lotusdriver10

Remind me at which point the Soviet Union entered WW2 to fight the Nazis... Astute historians put it sometime after they were thrashed by the plucky Finns, and after Adolf had been given a kicking attempting to invade us. Aside from that I suspect there are probably more Neo Nazis in the USA and so on.... Best not tell Darth Putin

[Bobcode]

Isn't strange in 1939 we waged war against a far-right Nazi power and with the help of our Russian allies we overcame them in 1945. How the tables have turned we are now supporting a far-right governed country with learnings towards Nazism fighting against our old allies who helped us stamp out Nazism in 1945.

I think you are a bit wide of the mark there. Without the considerable assistance from Britain and the US, Russia would have been hard pressed to withstand the German invasion. They only fought for their own ends. As for the assertion that Ukraine is a far- right country I feel you need to check your facts.
The bottom line is Russia has invaded and waged war against a peaceful country, there was no justification for such an act. Territorial gain and the acquisition of vast natural resources are the only aim of Russia, anything else is typical Russian deceit.
I am old enough to remember many that served in WW2 saying we fought the wrong enemy, given the actions of Russia, they may well have had a point.

[C24]

Looks like there are some fans of Comrade Corbyn on FC

Strange comment.

I too, had reached a similar conclusion. Perhaps not supporting the Russian move but giving biased comments.

The statement “ The enemy of my enemy is my friend “ is worth remembering in war. NATO is a good example of this policy.

German-Soviet Nonaggression Pact, also called Nazi-Soviet Nonaggression Pact, German-Soviet Treaty of Nonaggression, Hitler-Stalin Pact, and Molotov-Ribbentrop Pact, (August 23, 1939), nonaggression pact between Germany and the Soviet Union that was concluded only a few days before the beginning of World War II and which divided eastern Europe into German and Soviet spheres of influence.

The Allies helped the Soviets to overcome the Axis Powers, then concentrated on reducing Communism in Europe and beyond.

The Soviets, after 1945 did not relinquish their hold/control over the peoples assets that they had stolen.
The Ukraine land-grab of 8 yrs ago continuing now, illustrates the Moscow approach to their neighbours.

Tread softly, and carry a big stick.

[steamy]

Russia was always at war with the Nazi's (Probably before Britain was) so If? there were or even still are factions of Nazi's within Ukraine - kind of throws some light on possibly why Putin did what he did.

ah yeah, his neo Nazi's are OK though, good skins

Can you repeat that in English please and no double Dutch.

Does it not translate well in Google translate?

[Col Nago]

You know it’s a sign when even your SAM systems have had enough of you.

https://twitter.com/chrisschmitz/status ... 9ncihrOywQ

[zero_gravity]

NAVAREA XIX 133/22
ISPS SECURITY INFOMATION NORWEGIAN PORTS

PLEASE BE INFORMED THAT THE MARITIME SECURITY LEVEL IS RAISED TO LEVEL 2 FROM 301100 UTC SEP 22 IN THE FOLLOWING NORWEGIAN PORT FACILLITIES.
NOMON-0001. EQUINORD MONGSTAD
NOSTU-0001. STURETERMINALEN OEYGARDEN
NOKAS-0059. KAARSTOE GAS PROSSING PLANT
NOKON-0001. KOLLNES PROSSESING PLANT, OEYGARDEN
NOTBO-0001. TJELLBERGODDEN PORT
NOFRO-0003. FJORD BASE AS
NOMLK-0001. HAMMERFEST LNG MELKOEYA
NOAUK-0002. NYHAMNA GAS PLANT
NOAVE-0001. NORSEA VESTBASE AVEROEY
NOSLA-0002. NORSEA TANANGER
NOLRI-0003. NORSEA STORD BASE
NOHFT-0005. NORSEA POLARBASE
NOSVG-0008. NORSEA DUSAVIK
NOKSU-0014. NORSEA VESTBASE KRITIANSUND
NOMON-0002. MONGSTAD BASE
NOSSJ-0007. HELGELAND BASE
NOTAE-0002. CONOCO PHILLIPS BASE TANANGER
NOAGO-0001. COST CENTER BASE
NOSLA-0003. OFFSHORE TERMINAL


SHIPS CALLING AT THESE FACILLITIES SHALL RESPOND WITHOUT DELAY TO THIS CHANGE IN SECURITY LEVEL.

[effects]

Looks like the Russians have been booted out of Lyman, slaughter is a term being banded about.
You reap what you sow.

[Col Nago]

Yeah, Russia is trying to claim that it was another tactical retreat, but from the accounts I’m reading, they’ve tactically retreated into a circle surrounded by the UF.

[C24]

Re Nord Stream “leaks” causing the Norwegian action above. Could this be part of the strategy which involves viewtopic.php?f=287&t=214914&p=1372067& ... s#p1372067. ?

And the reason for the forthcoming exercise off the SW coast ? Checking for aggressive moves by foreign powers?

The conscription move by Putin. In the Korean War, as several books have reported, untrained and unequipped recruits were sent in second and third waves of mass attacks. They were cannon fodder, being expected to gather dropped weapons from the injured in the initial wave of the attack.

Just a thought or two..
Don’t forget to send your fuel supplier the meter readings. They will then have a base figure for the new rates.

Stay safe

[EGDR]

Isn't strange in 1939 we waged war against a far-right Nazi power and with the help of our Russian allies we overcame them in 1945. How the tables have turned we are now supporting a far-right governed country with learnings towards Nazism fighting against our old allies who helped us stamp out Nazism in 1945.

Russia was never on anyones side but their own during WWII and then look what happened post war.

As for a far-right Ukraine. You really need to read up on what you’re posting.

Russia was always at war with the Nazi's (Probably before Britain was)

This is just plainly incorrect.

Germany received 800,000 tons of oil from the Soviet Union, alongside 450,000 tons of iron and 1.5 million tons of grain products. In return, Germany supplied the Soviets with heavy machinery and munitions, the heavy cruiser Lützow was transferred to the Soviet Navy, while the air force received a selection of the latest German combat aircraft for trials. This was all arranged and took place after the invasion of Poland (another example of German-Soviet cooperation) and Britain's declaration of war. Soviet raw materials literally fueled the blitz. You can argue all you want about closeted intentions - we know that privately that German high command were not actually interested in pursuing this as a long term relationship, but the relationship was there and it was not one of belligerents in a war.

[Finty]

Well said. Even primary school kids probably know that Britain was at war with the Nazis for longer than the USSR, or maybe lotus lives in a parallel universe where 1941 happened before 1939! I’d expect someone on a British aviation forum to know that the Battle of Britain occurred before Barbarossa…

I think most people are under the impression that Ukraine was/is just a "Land Grab" by Russia - it certainly is not the case,

Well it wasn’t certain that there wouldn’t be a land grab, this hasn’t aged well.

[Col Nago]

Hi Craig. Just checking in to see how Mighty Russian Army doing? When will the devastating T-55 be deployed ? (from museums).

[paddyboy]

[Blackcat1]

Well said. Even primary school kids probably know that Britain was at war with the Nazis for longer than the USSR, or maybe lotus lives in a parallel universe where 1941 happened before 1939! I’d expect someone on a British aviation forum to know that the Battle of Britain occurred before Barbarossa…

I think most people are under the impression that Ukraine was/is just a "Land Grab" by Russia - it certainly is not the case,

Well it wasn’t certain that there wouldn’t be a land grab, this hasn’t aged well.

Some history books supposedly say that the Russians have been fighting nazi fascism for hundreds of years - they say starting with the Khazarians don't ask me as I have not read these books.

Kardashian’s surely?

[100arw]

And the reason for the forthcoming exercise off the SW coast ? Checking for aggressive moves by foreign powers?

No. Its to add the usual ships taking part in FOST, to the three in Scotland on Joint Warrior to try and make the 40, then 20 they said in the Navy press release woud be taking part in Joint Warrior :-)
P.

[Finty]

Some history books supposedly say that the Russians have been fighting nazi fascism for hundreds of years - they say starting with the Khazarians don't ask me as I have not read these books.

Sounds like drivel, do some research before spouting such nonsense, or at least make your lies believable.

[iainpeden]

Lotus
A simple search on wikipedia gives you a potted history of Ukraine over the last 1000 years or so

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ukraine

To say it's convoluted is something of an understatement.

Your post yesterday evening, despite a clear ignorance of the actual history, did make me think on this points, "When and where did fascism arise?" and where did it did the Germans get so involved.

The answer to the first is almost certainly Imperial Rome, I suspect the answer to the second is with the Prussian military prior to the unification of Germany in 1871. However, I suggest you do some research into the totalitarian Nazi regime and the totalitarian Stalinist regime - you cant get a cigarette paper between the two.

[slogen51]

You could say Russia had problems with their Royal family and they basically wiped them all out barely a 100 years ago which included killing children - nice bunch!!

I don't know why you keep banging on about Nazism? Unless you think it justifies russians bombing residential flats in the Ukraine?

I don't know if your support of Russia is you playing some form of perverse intellectual ' devil's advocate ' to promote discussion but using death and war to demonstrate your advocacy skill doesn't impress me.

[Col Nago]

A bridge too far this morning...