Royal International Air Tattoo 2013

[Malcolm]

A very large proportion of the attendance - which I understand from the BBC News this lunchtime was a sell-out both days .

I find this quite hard to believe. We situated ourselves at the extreme western end for Saturdays flying display (Behind the German A310). There were only a few people there - less than a dozen of us taking photos of the landing aircraft at the touch down point. No problems at all getting to the crowd line. I've seen more people in the Desert at Nellis (old days) and in the field at the end of Minzk Maz on a Radom show day. Some of the reason may have been the constant tyre squealing from the Caterham rides, but we had no problems lying down for a kip over lunchtime and just strolling up to the fenceline when something interesting was on. It seemed to us that attendance was way way lower than many recent years.

[Rant Mode On]

I know it's not the organiser's fault - they doubtless try every trick in ther book - but it did feel like some of the magic of past IAT/RIAT's has gone. Higlights for me this year were the An2, the Brazilian R99, and the fact I potted 3 Casa 235/295. But as we sat watching the flying displays there wasn't anything 'super-rare' on it. Rarest thing was probably the Estonian L-39. Yes the yanks were missing, but no static RAF/Navy/Army Sentinel, Sentry, Shadow, Tristar, C-130, Tutor, Gazelle, Lynx7/9, Wildcat, SK4, SK5, SK-AEW, Hawk T1, Chinook the list goes on and on. Frankly, charity begins at home, and if the home team can't/won't support RIAT then why should we expect the foreign nations to?

And as for the air display rules - what a load of absolute horse s**t. Counting touch and goes as aerobatics, and therefore forbiding them within 230m of the crowdline, thus making them impossible because the runway is less than 230m away. Regulation of airshows is required, as evidenced by the Farnborough and Ramstein disasters, but we're heading for a scenario where the Fairford flying displays will be carried out over Brize.

Next year is a Farnborough year so should hopefully be better.

[Rant Mode off]

[Al dunn]

A very large proportion of the attendance - which I understand from the BBC News this lunchtime was a sell-out both days .

And as for the air display rules - what a load of absolute horse s**t. Counting touch and goes as aerobatics, and therefore forbiding them within 230m of the crowdline, thus making them impossible because the runway is less than 230m away. Regulation of airshows is required, as evidenced by the Farnborough and Ramstein disasters, but we're heading for a scenario where the Fairford flying displays will be carried out over Brize.

I think the French were flying over Brize on Sunday they seemd really far away from the crowd compared to the Reds and Swiss PC7 team

Regards

Al

[Malcolm]

A very large proportion of the attendance - which I understand from the BBC News this lunchtime was a sell-out both days .

And as for the air display rules - what a load of absolute horse s**t. Counting touch and goes as aerobatics, and therefore forbiding them within 230m of the crowdline, thus making them impossible because the runway is less than 230m away. Regulation of airshows is required, as evidenced by the Farnborough and Ramstein disasters, but we're heading for a scenario where the Fairford flying displays will be carried out over Brize.

I think the French were flying over Brize on Sunday they seemd really far away from the crowd compared to the Reds and Swiss PC7 team

Regards

Al

I actually thought the Reds were breaking the rules quite a lot on Saturday, as did the A380 on it's second pass. Perhaps they've got dispensation, or perhaps they just tend to get away with it because of who/what they are.

Didn't see the Swiss (they were on last and we bailed before then) and the French were Sunday only.

The example given by the commentators was the Dutch F-16. The normal display consisted of a touch and go straight into a vertical loop to land. The vertical loop is deemed aerobatics so has to be 230 m from crowdline. The runway is only 150m ish away. so the touch and go gets binned. At the 230m display line, minimum altitude is 100 ft (or was it 500'), so it's a simulated touch and go at 100'(500') into a vertical loop to land. Which is nothing like as impressive as the original manoever.

[seven]

Bob, you raise a good point regarding the 'invited' air arms being unable to attend due to exercises etc, that is something we should have taken into account. The financial climate, however, is obvious to one and all. But that is not something that explains why they refused to book the Viggen (stating it doesnt justify the cost!) yet booking the Eurocopter demo, Catalina (grossly unsuited to this event and viewable by the majority of the enthusiasts at Duxford the week before-and how many kids are going to run home and climb the walls in excitement because they've seen that) plus the Red Star rebels, for example in the static, none of these actually brought anyone through the gates, whereas said Viggen would have. Whilst i do accept the fact as we all should that RIAT is not what it used to be, and never will be again, this year i feel they have let us down. However it must be stated that apart from a few acts, the flying display was pretty good, and without a doubt no UK show this year will match it. Had the weather been FORECAST differently, the numbers through the gates would have been significantly lower. Also, our (mine and RIAT's) interpretation of sold out must be very different, because it sure as 'eck wasn't when i was there, numbers looking to me to be equal to or less than last year.

7

PS FLYING BULLS

[Cortinamk4]

Like many I have been fortunate to see most RIAT shows in its various guises since the early eighties from Greenham to Fairford via Boscombe and Cottesmore and as an enthusiast share many of the frustrations voiced on the forum. However I am pragmatic in what is achievable, given the variables of armed forces priorities the world over, by DBH. The empty static wasn't helped by late withdrawals of 2x C130 and a 767, so having tried to fill some of the space normally filled by the USAF operational life intervened. The UK still has one of the most dynamic Airshow scenes but maintaining it will only get more difficult as the resources of HM armed forces keep reducing alongside those of our NATO allies, who a year ago never mind ten, twenty or thirty years ago would ever of envisaged the US armed forces having budget problems!
I have attended RIAT over the years with my Dad, my eldest son [who joined the RAF due to the influence it had on him] and now my youngest son and various friends and whatever the line up or weather good or bad have always made the best of it.
This year with the limited static myself and youngest spent more time talking to aircrew and as a result got invited into the BAE Jetstream test bed and the Polish Navy Bryza. The talk and insight into the development work on the Jetstream was fascinating and the mission equipment they fit in a small aircraft like the Bryza is amazing especially when at 5'4" a shortie like myself could not stand upright in it. So whilst I wish for the return of lines of tankers, transports and fighters from many corners of the world like the lottery numbers it very likely isn't going to happen. So what is the answer scrap the majority of the UK airshow scene and concentrate on one or two venues as many of our European neighbours do? But which ones and who is willing for their 'local' show to disappear to feed the few! Can you imagine the traffic chaos if the country had only one or two airshows a year, I unfortunately remember the 2-3hour queues to get put of RIAT in the nineties. I don't have any answers but maybe we haven't got it so bad, after all we could be in Amercia!

[rh226]

Well said!!

[beefsteak]

Had a cracking few days , loads of good pictures. Highlights for me , A-400, Cj-27 Spartan, Flying Bulls, The Reds , tricky frecolorri ( sic ) F-16 , Meteor was really nice to see, the shock arrival of the Canberra, Friday evenings Spit display in the twilight was really atmospheric.

The lows, shove you pat france up your 4r53, and the swiss for that matter , Jordanian falcons, oh come on , who are they trying to kid, the lack of Russian / American flying, and no Tornado display, the distinct (Seemingly) lack of organisation on the Sunday. (According to the programme the Meteor was due on at 3 (I think) and came screaming through as I was getting lunch (around 12 ish!)) I know Pat France went tech as did the f-16 just after he gave us a mini sonic boom ! but it's no real excuse to be left guessing is it?

[Dan213]

Had a cracking few days , loads of good pictures. Highlights for me , A-400, Cj-27 Spartan, Flying Bulls, The Reds , tricky frecolorri ( sic ) F-16 , Meteor was really nice to see, the shock arrival of the Canberra, Friday evenings Spit display in the twilight was really atmospheric.

The lows, shove you pat france up your 4r53, and the swiss for that matter , Jordanian falcons, oh come on , who are they trying to kid, the lack of Russian / American flying, and no Tornado display, the distinct (Seemingly) lack of organisation on the Sunday. (According to the programme the Meteor was due on at 3 (I think) and came screaming through as I was getting lunch (around 12 ish!)) I know Pat France went tech as did the f-16 just after he gave us a mini sonic boom ! but it's no real excuse to be left guessing is it?

If you had listened to the commentary, you would have noted the changes to the display programme. Unfortunately, due to serviceability issues, not all displays can appear as scheduled. What do you expect them to do, take in everyone's programme and exchange it for a new one every time there is a slight change of schedule?

[wave scanner]

Had a cracking few days , loads of good pictures. Highlights for me , A-400, Cj-27 Spartan, Flying Bulls, The Reds , tricky frecolorri ( sic ) F-16 , Meteor was really nice to see, the shock arrival of the Canberra, Friday evenings Spit display in the twilight was really atmospheric.

The lows, shove you pat france up your 4r53, and the swiss for that matter , Jordanian falcons, oh come on , who are they trying to kid, the lack of Russian / American flying, and no Tornado display, the distinct (Seemingly) lack of organisation on the Sunday. (According to the programme the Meteor was due on at 3 (I think) and came screaming through as I was getting lunch (around 12 ish!)) I know Pat France went tech as did the f-16 just after he gave us a mini sonic boom ! but it's no real excuse to be left guessing is it?

If you had listened to the commentary, you would have noted the changes to the display programme. Unfortunately, due to serviceability issues, not all displays can appear as scheduled. What do you expect them to do, take in everyone's programme and exchange it for a new one every time there is a slight change of schedule?

Hehehe it's easy to find out what's going on if you tune your scanner to the tower & ground frequencies

[POL]

Hehehe it's easy to find out what's going on if you tune your scanner to the tower & ground frequencies

Same applies of departure day when everyone gets caught out by an arriving Italian C-130J, or the ETPS A109 departing the wrong way down the runway!

[Skywatcher]

It could be like many US shows that have a three day public access days ,like the shows in Nevada and the ones in Miami where they also do a night show ,I personally don't see this as a big problem as this will mean we will get much more flying I also really really enjoyed RIAT this year even though there was less aircraft than in many years,but i thought it was well organised and a very good show!! my fav displays from the weekend where the raf typhoon fgr4 display ,the b-17 (never seen her flying before),the mig 29 and the reds flypast with the A380 all in all a very good weekend Thankyou Riat team!! looking forward to next year already

[bizfreeq]

The Service areas were good, but a +15 minute round trip to the toilet wasn't great, although when you got there the queues were minimal (for the gents at least!).

That is because no one could find them!! The toilets are my only gripe for the whole show,put it back how it was before,it worked,why b**ger about with them??
Fantastic show all considering,and had a great time on departures day too...at the wrong end (which turned out to be the right end in my opinion...low departures and topsides against the usual taxi shots...no brainer!)

[wave scanner]

The toilets were Kept very clean & tidy all day long on Saturday, they could have done with an In/out system though to be honest

[Dan213]

hello,could anyone tell me was prince harry there and did he arrive in the apache on Thursday, did he fly any other days ?

No he didn't...

[POL]

Considering the crew that fly the display have to be the crew that validated the display, the chances of it being him are slim to non-existent.

[Dan213]

Considering the crew that fly the display have to be the crew that validated the display, the chances of it being him are slim to non-existent.

+1

[Andy Marden]

It wasn't him.
I personally met the Apache crew on their arrival on Thursday....

[beefsteak]

Had a cracking few days , loads of good pictures. Highlights for me , A-400, Cj-27 Spartan, Flying Bulls, The Reds , tricky frecolorri ( sic ) F-16 , Meteor was really nice to see, the shock arrival of the Canberra, Friday evenings Spit display in the twilight was really atmospheric.

The lows, shove you pat france up your 4r53, and the swiss for that matter , Jordanian falcons, oh come on , who are they trying to kid, the lack of Russian / American flying, and no Tornado display, the distinct (Seemingly) lack of organisation on the Sunday. (According to the programme the Meteor was due on at 3 (I think) and came screaming through as I was getting lunch (around 12 ish!)) I know Pat France went tech as did the f-16 just after he gave us a mini sonic boom ! but it's no real excuse to be left guessing is it?

If you had listened to the commentary, you would have noted the changes to the display programme. Unfortunately, due to serviceability issues, not all displays can appear as scheduled. What do you expect them to do, take in everyone's programme and exchange it for a new one every time there is a slight change of schedule?

And if one is deaf ? Oh that makes it all ok does it ?

[Mike]

Had a cracking few days , loads of good pictures. Highlights for me , A-400, Cj-27 Spartan, Flying Bulls, The Reds , tricky frecolorri ( sic ) F-16 , Meteor was really nice to see, the shock arrival of the Canberra, Friday evenings Spit display in the twilight was really atmospheric.

The lows, shove you pat france up your 4r53, and the swiss for that matter , Jordanian falcons, oh come on , who are they trying to kid, the lack of Russian / American flying, and no Tornado display, the distinct (Seemingly) lack of organisation on the Sunday. (According to the programme the Meteor was due on at 3 (I think) and came screaming through as I was getting lunch (around 12 ish!)) I know Pat France went tech as did the f-16 just after he gave us a mini sonic boom ! but it's no real excuse to be left guessing is it?

If you had listened to the commentary, you would have noted the changes to the display programme. Unfortunately, due to serviceability issues, not all displays can appear as scheduled. What do you expect them to do, take in everyone's programme and exchange it for a new one every time there is a slight change of schedule?

And if one is deaf ? Oh that makes it all ok does it ?

Sorry ?

[beefsteak]

What for ?