Formula 1 2023

[2e1var]

I like Norris and don't get the silver spoon thing, it might get you into racing in the first place but without talent you won't get far. Hamilton's dad bought him into carting, he just had to work harder to do it.
Norris was 2015 MSA Champ, 2016 Euro Formula Renault Champ, 2017 Euro F3 Champ and 2018 F2 Runner up.
As for Piastri his father is a multi millionaire too who put significant cash behind his career so if you want to talk about silver spoons he equally falls into that bracket. He's been even more successful being 2020 F3 champ and 2021 F2 champ, just timing keeping him out of F1 in 2022.
Both great talents and as a McLaren fan I hope we see them back at the front soon.
Do we have any real pay drivers on the grid that shouldn't really be in F1 at the moment, the likes of Maldonado? I know Mick was there really because he bought cash, not sure about now?

[raptor9]

Don't think there are any pay-to-drive these days. Last real one was Nicholas Latifi, and how most of us wish he wasn't there!!!

[2e1var]

I don't really think they are 'pay to drive' just come with lots of sponsors, certainly that's what put Maldonado and Mick on the grid. Latifi is an odd one, achieved nothing basically then 2nd in f2 championship, 3 years in f1 then nothing. Hopefully Williams are in a place now where they don't have to take cash over talent although Sargeants record isn't exactly outstanding.

[slogen51]

Slogen, agree totally with your last post. Ron Dennis was very impressed with him when they met. I think Lewis was 10 at the time??

I do admittedly bang on about this all the time but I met Lewis once or twice while I worked at McLaren Woking, he would come along with his trainer to the after work basketball matches ( 10 of us would get together to play basketball in a byfleet school gym that was available after 6pm) I didn't know who he was we were only asked for no heavy tackles (basketball is meant to be contactless). In other words a completely normal background apart from being nurtured by Ron Dennis.

In other words a fairly conventional background whilst many drivers seem to come from serious money or have family connections in the sport. Nothing against Lando in fact he seems likeable however F1 as opposed to Motorsport in general seems to be a closed shop where only drivers with the right connections can progress. Contrast that with super bikes where most of the riders are bikers first irrespective of success.

I missed out that I realize Lando doesn't bring money to the team he is there on talent but his father is extremely rich and that must make a difference in terms of time and facilities that were made available to him.

[slogen51]

" As for Piastri his father is a multi millionaire too who put significant cash behind his career"

That's what I am talking about - these so called best in the world drivers are the top of a very small pile

[plmc135]

" As for Piastri his father is a multi millionaire too who put significant cash behind his career"

That's what I am talking about - these so called best in the world drivers are the top of a very small pile

Don't you mean "are on the top of a very large pile"

[slogen51]

No

I mean they are the pinnacle of a small number of drivers

[seven]

Not sure how Stroll is not counted as a paid driver...
Technically Tsunoda is a paid driver too, as he is funded by Honda.
Pretty sure Guanyu Zhou wouldn't be where he was if it wasn't for substantial sponsorship.
Also AIR Albon is at least partly paid by reb dull still, so it could be argued he's a paid driver too!

[Ghostrider01]

I don't really think they are 'pay to drive' just come with lots of sponsors, certainly that's what put Maldonado and Mick on the grid. Latifi is an odd one, achieved nothing basically then 2nd in f2 championship, 3 years in f1 then nothing. Hopefully Williams are in a place now where they don't have to take cash over talent although Sargeants record isn't exactly outstanding.

Latifi did achieve one thing ... he handed a world championship to Verstappen (or took it away from Hamilton) with an assist from the FIA

[slogen51]

The luck goes around though - Hamilton was unlucky in 2007 although to give Lewis credit he says he lost the championship but he was lucky in 2008 in the rain where he thought he had to pass vettel which he wasn't going to do in a hurry when the rain changed it all and other drivers didn't pit and effectively went backwards for him!

[seven]

Regarding 2008, he wouldn't have been in that position had Ferrari not botched Massa's pitstop in Singapore. Sounds familiar doesn't it!

[2e1var]

Not sure how Stroll is not counted as a paid driver...
Technically Tsunoda is a paid driver too, as he is funded by Honda.
Pretty sure Guanyu Zhou wouldn't be where he was if it wasn't for substantial sponsorship.
Also AIR Albon is at least partly paid by reb dull still, so it could be argued he's a paid driver too!

Good point, 3 names I wouldn't miss in there, I wonder how long Stroll senior will put up with junior, he's a business man after all and seems to be taking the whole Aston thing very seriously. Didn't RB release Albon after Toto spat his dummy out about an RB driver being in a Merc engined car? I actually think Albon is quite good, don't mind him. Mick is driving the Merc next week for a tyre test following the race in Barcelona.

[2e1var]

The luck goes around though - Hamilton was unlucky in 2007 although to give Lewis credit he says he lost the championship but he was lucky in 2008 in the rain where he thought he had to pass vettel which he wasn't going to do in a hurry when the rain changed it all and other drivers didn't pit and effectively went backwards for him!

In a world of 'What Ifs' Alonso is just 8 points away from being a 5 time world champion

2007 3rd - 1 point
2010 2nd - 4 points
2012 2nd - 3 points

I really used to despise the guy, 'Fernando is faster than you' and breaking gear box seals to move him up the grid but just goes to show what a massive difference a few points can make. I quite like him now he's back, felt the same when Schuey came back. In the absence of a competitive Merc I'm Alonso all the way, I hope Monaco wasn't his only chance of a win, I feel a Red Bull failure will be the only way now but they do happen.

[slogen51]

Alonso is happy when he is numero uno in the team

Alonso doesn't need a PR person, he himself is an expert!

Vettel and Alonso both at Aston would have had plenty of fun and Bro moments until push quite literally came to shove

[2e1var]

Alonso is happy when he is numero uno in the team

Alonso doesn't need a PR person, he himself is an expert!

Vettel and Alonso both at Aston would have had plenty of fun and Bro moments until push quite literally came to shove

Never rated Vettel, technically as a driver he was excellent, as a racer he was poor. In the best kit he'd bang it on pole and lead from start to finish, as soon as you put him in the pack he'd completely lose the plot, much like Max. Now Alonso and Hamilton, they can race.

[raptor9]

Beginning to warm to Alonso, but He has a lot of making up to do for me to forgive him for the way he treated Lewis when they were on the same team.

[seven]

AFAIR, it was as much Hamilton as it was Alonso in that respect. His behind the scenes antics with PdlR however.. That should have been a ban from the sport on the spot. But the relationship between Adolf Mosley and Ron Dennis put paid to that.

[raptor9]

Interesting afternoon in prospect[ I hope!] I was a little perturbed by some of Martin Brundle's comments about some of the 'corners/curves' saying that these days, these are flat out in a F.1 car!!. Therefore it is no challenge to the driver!. Corners should NOT be able to be taken flat out. Surely the essence of racing is the skill of the driver in corners as well as speed on the straight. A worrying trend in my opinion!.

[slogen51]

You have to have some corners flat out as a test of bravery and down force

Woodcott around to Becketts is probably flat out these days and the parabella? at Monza must have always been flat out - both legendary circuits

[raptor9]

I agree with you, Slogen, but there seem to be too many flat out on some circuits. The Parabolica at Monza I believe is not flat out in a F.1 car [maybe in a slow one!! ]