New trains for Greater Anglia made in Switzerland

[slogen51]

Just seen on the TV news that new trains for Greater Anglia and the Stansted express are being built in Bussnang Switzerland.

I Thought British trains were made in Derby - I must be living in the past!

Perhaps the British train manufacturers are running at full capacity so Switzerland got the deal.

[Pen Pusher]

The Azuma trains that Virgin were going to introduce on the East Coat Line are made in Japan along with the Javelin that runs from St Pancras, new Govia Thameslink trains are built in Germany etc, etc.

Brian

[Bobcode]

If that is the case, can we please have the Swiss efficiency and superb timetables to go with them ?

[H.A.Bucken]

I've seen in one of the steam monthlies that trackwork at the Mid Norfolk Railway is to be doubled, first to store these new trains then after they're introduced, displaced 153, 156 and 170 units will be stored there.
Roger

[ChrisCwmbran]

Bring back B.R.E.L!!!!

[Nighthawke]

I've seen in one of the steam monthlies that trackwork at the Mid Norfolk Railway is to be doubled, first to store these new trains then after they're introduced, displaced 153, 156 and 170 units will be stored there.
Roger

For anyone interested, here is a link to the local newspaper article:

http://www.derehamtimes.co.uk/news/mid- ... -1-5586057

[slogen51]

What happens to old trains are they melted down or is there a Davis-Monthan equivalent for locomotives?

[Marham Residential]

Pleased to help with this.

I was a senior manager with said org, until retirement, sorry bliss, 18 months ago.

The original observation is correct. The Inter City trains ie Norwich to London and Stansted trains are indeed being built in Switzerland. The name of the units, believe it or not, are “Flirts” . (One could not make it up!) Something like 350 carriages in total plus power cars.

The remainder of the other are inner city units being built in Derby total 670 carriages inc power units.

Total investment is about £1.4 billion!

The Derby works, which I have been to, take up the old LMS site . The manufacturers are Bombardier a Canadian company as many of you know, also manufacturer aeroplanes.

Other than foreign owned “assembley” sites , British owned train carriage and locomotive manufacturing died many years ago.

The major rail suppliers are in the main, EU countries, Canada and Japan. Weird how they looked after their industrial base after copying British technologies , whereas we decided, no sorry our Government decided, not to. ?

Similar story to the Harrier and F35 maybe?

[dragonchaser]

What happens to old trains are they melted down or is there a Davis-Monthan equivalent for locomotives?

Most end up in various scrapyards around the country.

[Nighthawke]

Some of the GA fleet still have some life left in them so may possibly go to other parts of the country that have older classes. Some may go abroad for similar reasons, be preserved by heritage railways or sold to private owners. Otherwise scrapped.

[slogen51]

Thanks

At least some of the contract is being built by British workers in Derby even if the company is Canadian.

Switzerland are not even a member of the EU - just seems a shame that train operators go out side the UK/EU to buy new equipment. Hard to believe that Swiss or Japanese unit costs are lower than that of British manufacturers.

[DAVEBRAD]

hi morning,
I used to work for another Bombardier site at Crewe, they took over the BREL works, we mainly did steam back in the day, then diesels and finally electric loco's.
As to the Davis-Monthan of loco's Barry island for steam...and diesels at most of the works- Crewe, Doncaster, Derby, Swindon,
From the Beeching era, then the early 80's it came down to money... pre that time we had stock available at sheds that if a carriage or loco broke down could be exchanged and so the affected train could still run, but now no spares so the trains cancelled. Same with staff, at Crewe at the end of one of its platforms was a tea hut, where spare crews waited, then someone up the food chain must have become aware of it and thought "we can save money instead of paying this lot for sitting round all day stop it". Now e have to rely on overtime working to keep the system going, they are still paying money out and look what happens when we get to the quarter finals of a world cup, the service stops.


Sorry rant over, i'm going for a lay down and a cuppa... but just think on next time your on a motorway and all those artics crawling past, they should be on the rails...(Beeching I wouldn't have had him cleaning loco's).


regards,
dave...

[Marham Residential]

Some of the GA fleet still have some life left in them so may possibly go to other parts of the country that have older classes. Some may go abroad for similar reasons, be preserved by heritage railways or sold to private owners. Otherwise scrapped.

Newest of the current fleet, Class 379’s currently operating on the Stanex and Cambridge routes introduced in Dec 2011 will be surplus to requirements as are all the current Greater Anglia trains. These 379’s are great trains and will be sent to various TOCs or one specific ToC elsewhere in the UK.
The remaining units on the West Anglia route are 317’s a much revamped BR build from the 70’s.

The Eastern side of Greater Anglia run various units diesel and electric plus the old loco hauled “Inter City” stock on the Norwich services.

Quite a turn around when the new units come on stream

[blackregs]

Deleted

[DAVEBRAD]

hi,
or FANGO...fast automatic no guards operated, If management get their way.

regards,
dave...

[ChrisCwmbran]

hi,
or FANGO...fast automatic no guards operated, If management get their way.

regards,
dave...

Can you blame the management? Over the years Guards have progressively given up more and more of their role to the point where the justifiability of their jobs is now totally open to question. The Unions have basically talked their staff out of their jobs.....

[Marham Residential]

hi,
or FANGO...fast automatic no guards operated, If management get their way.

regards,
dave...

This is a bit of a non argument in reality. When I joined WAGN, later to become Greater Anglia 20odd years ago the WEST Anglia Route, class 317 and 315 were ALL Driver Operated Only (DOO) using platform based CCTV monitors or “ lookback” on straight platforms. Guards didn’t exist then!

Class 379 and ALL these new trains have trainside mounted CCTV cameras so the driver can look at every door prior to closure.
I won’t go into technical detail but I can assure you it’s FAR safer than having two or more people involved in the dispatch process. More staff involved in the process means more imported risk. This “extra pair of eyes” argument prior to dispatch is something of a red herring.

I used to write and be involved in Train Dispatch Risk Assessments as part of my role

[DAVEBRAD]

hi,

maybe so to a certain extent but its management now who are trying to remove guards from trains, a guard is needed if there is trouble or a problem with the passengers safety. If there is a problem and theres no guard you pull the comm. cord and wait for the driver to get to you, then after he sorts the problem he has to reset the brakes all this takes time, and the roads blocked till hes ready to go. I.m not up on their duties now but they used to be the trains rear safety, ie going back for up to 2mls placing detonators to warn and protect his train, as the driver protected the front, With more and more stations being closed, who will collect fares?

I'm not union or management but common sense says its a 2 man/woman operation...

[Marham Residential]

hi,

maybe so to a certain extent but its management now who are trying to remove guards from trains, a guard is needed if there is trouble or a problem with the passengers safety. If there is a problem and theres no guard you pull the comm. cord and wait for the driver to get to you, then after he sorts the problem he has to reset the brakes all this takes time, and the roads blocked till hes ready to go. I.m not up on their duties now but they used to be the trains rear safety, ie going back for up to 2mls placing detonators to warn and protect his train, as the driver protected the front, With more and more stations being closed, who will collect fares?

I'm not union or management but common sense says its a 2 man/woman operation...

Trying to be a short in response
In DOO the entire control and operation of the train is the responsibility of the driver
Modern signalling system generally preclude the use of detonators as trains are electronically protected at the rear with signalling protecting each section
Re detonators the old rule was 1 and 1/4 mile not 2 miles (from memory)
Generally fares are NOT collected on trains that operate “Penalty Fare Scheme”. Greater Anglia has been covered by this scheme for about 25 years . Ie Must have ticket BEFORE boarding a train. Platform based ticket machines are provided as well as internet based purchased tickets via smart phones or smart cards
I won’t add to the one person /two person debate as I have already commented , other than to say one man/ woman operation of trains is fully endorsed by every railway professional body in the uk.Has been tested in court a number
Guards did not pull commms chords. They are there for public (mis)use


UK rail safety is one of the best in Europe with ONE passenger death in the last 11 years (see below)

https://www.theguardian.com/business/bl ... am-ruddick

[DAVEBRAD]

hi MR,
thanks for the update, on conditions as I said i'm out of touch. On your point about guards pulling the comm. cord I think you misunderstood my comment, I meant if a incident occurred and someone pulled it with cause or more likely nowadays misuse, without a guard the onus is on the driver to find the cause, then deal with it, then reset it...

regards,
dave...