FighterControl

The 24 planned to embark for CSG25 are NOT all RAF/FAA aircraft.

tommc wrote: ↑

Sat Mar 22, 2025 5:59 pm

The 24 planned to embark for CSG25 are NOT all RAF/FAA aircraft.

Yes they are.

COMUKCSG confirmed so last year.

https://www.navylookout.com/is-the-roya ... r-to-home/

However, it is looking extremely unlikely.

At best, I suspect they will load on 18-24 for the initial stages down to the Med and then disembark a squadrons worth.

Forgot to post this earlier, worth having a thread on the subject. Highmast is the sequel to CSG21, but this time its HMS Prince of Wales on an approx 7 month deployment with 24 F-35Bs embarked, among other things.

https://www.raf.mod.uk/news/articles/uk ... c-mission/

Are the F35's all RAF/RN or are the US Marines bolstering the numbers again?

As far as I can see, the article doesn't specify how many F-35B will be on board, only that two of our squadrons will be on board. However, if it is to be 24 F-35B on board (and I have heard that rumour elsewhere), as we only have had 29 delivered to the UK (and one of those is still rather wet around the edges!) I don't believe it can be 24 of ours.

Are any even painted in RN colours?

I’m wondering if the rumoured 10x USMC F-35’s to Lossiemouth next week for Ex Formidable Shield, are infact for CSG25? Deploying a whole Squadron requires a lot of support and I would’ve expected a couple of support flights over the past weeks, but nothing.

roger4 wrote: ↑

Sat Apr 19, 2025 8:25 am

As far as I can see, the article doesn't specify how many F-35B will be on board, only that two of our squadrons will be on board. However, if it is to be 24 F-35B on board (and I have heard that rumour elsewhere), as we only have had 29 delivered to the UK (and one of those is still rather wet around the edges!) I don't believe it can be 24 of ours.

Pendantic I know, but I think there are only 28 operational ( as far as we know!) /RN F-35B in the UK

35 delivered (ZM169/035) - 4 at Edwards or wherever - 2 on maintenance at Cherry Point - 1 drowned = 28

(I heard the two at Cherry Point plus ZM170 & ZM171 are expected end of April/beginning of May)

Rumours are the only USMC will embark from Iwakuni plus some Italian in the Mediterranean section of the cruise

Still plenty of time for support to arrive from Cherry Point for this exercise

Rumours this end are only 16 will embark prior to leaving the UK, and 8 of those will return prior to going through the Suez Canal. Supposedly only 207Sqn will be going on the full cruise.

sdad wrote: ↑

Sat Apr 19, 2025 8:46 am

Are any even painted in RN colours?

No, they are all painted in “Lightning Force” markings. That’s kind of how a combined fleet works you see.

Malcolm wrote: ↑

Sat Apr 19, 2025 9:40 am

Rumours this end are only 16 will embark prior to leaving the UK, and 8 of those will return prior to going through the Suez Canal. Supposedly only 207Sqn will be going on the full cruise.

207 are the OCU squadron so definitely not deploying

Will be 617 Sqn and 809 NAS deploying, the big question is how many jets will actually go.

POL wrote: ↑

Sat Apr 19, 2025 9:53 am

sdad wrote: ↑

Sat Apr 19, 2025 8:46 am

Are any even painted in RN colours?

No, they are all painted in “Lightning Force” markings. That’s kind of how a combined fleet works you see.

Never heard of Lightning Force but it's useful to know. No need for the second sentence. If I don't know, I don't know!

One of the issues highlighted in the F35 crash report was number of maintenance staff per airframe which was about half that of the USMC on the same cruise resulting in overwork and fatigue. It could be that they operate CSG25 with less airframes and the same amount of personnel to prevent that happening again.

Does anyone even know what the Unit Establishment (UE) is for F35 squadrons? Personally I think 12 a/c per squadron is way over optimistic, and I'd be thinking it was more like 8 / 9 at a push, on a good day, etc... Which makes the 2 squadrons and 16 a/c seem like a realistic number.

Thunder wrote: ↑

Sat Apr 19, 2025 8:51 am

I’m wondering if the rumoured 10x USMC F-35’s to Lossiemouth next week for Ex Formidable Shield, are infact for CSG25? Deploying a whole Squadron requires a lot of support and I would’ve expected a couple of support flights over the past weeks, but nothing.

The USMC are not going on the carrier, 617 Sqdn and 809 NAS are

The plan in 2021 was a fully sovereign air power deployment of 24 British F-35Bs.

Due to substantial delays in the delivery schedule, the plan is now "up-to" 24 British F-35Bs. Whatever the final total is, all 24 will not be sticking around for the entire deployment.

The plan that I have heard is that 809NAS will be returning before the carrier transits through Suez with the squadron offboarding to Akrotiri.

Italian, Japanese and USMC F-35Bs will be on/off at various points throughout the deployment.

Looking at all the media releases, I haven’t seen anything that suggests one of the squadrons will be returning early. In the latest edition of the RAF News, CO 809NAS comments suggest there are on board for the full deployment and the Lightning Air Wing Commanders comments also suggest both squadrons are on board for the full deployment. If one does come back before the Suez, they won’t be on board for very long, Exercise Talisman Sabre in Australia is during July.

RubyRoo wrote: ↑

Sat Mar 22, 2025 8:56 pm

tommc wrote: ↑

Sat Mar 22, 2025 5:59 pm

The 24 planned to embark for CSG25 are NOT all RAF/FAA aircraft.

Yes they are.

COMUKCSG confirmed so last year.

https://www.navylookout.com/is-the-roya ... r-to-home/

However, it is looking extremely unlikely.

At best, I suspect they will load on 18-24 for the initial stages down to the Med and then disembark a squadrons worth.

No, they are not all RAF/FAA jets. You should not rely on out of date and incorrect information.

Other operators will bolster the British jets during CSG25.

tommc wrote: ↑

Sun Apr 20, 2025 12:22 pm

No, they are not all RAF/FAA jets. You should not rely on out of date and incorrect information.

Other operators will bolster the British jets during CSG25.

Exactly, other operators will *bolster* during the deployment.

The intended 24 mentioned are all British owned and operated.

You have no idea what you're talking about. If you think differently, take it up with COMUKCSG.

https://www.navylookout.com/is-the-roya ... r-to-home/

If indeed the plan has changed, nothing has been mentioned other than an intention to take "up-to" 24 British F-35Bs on board for some of the deployment.