FighterControl

https://www.flightglobal.com/fixed-win ... 76.article

“US Air Force considers buying the E-7 Wedgetail”

Hmm I think that needs a thread of its own, I'm not sure where the USAF are going to get donor airframes from in the numbers they'll need!

EGVP wrote: ↑

Thu Sep 23, 2021 1:18 pm

Hmm I think that needs a thread of its own, I'm not sure where the USAF are going to get donor airframes from in the numbers they'll need!

Not sure if they are the same frame base, but SouthWest are currently retiring over 100 -700’s variants of the B737.

I can't read the article as it's asking me to pay to be a member, does it state specifically state that the USAF wants to procure using donor airframes? I know the E-7 is based on the -700, but you've still got the -800 derived P-8 in production which is also previous generation so I suspect for a sizeable order, it wouldn't take too much effort to new build the E-7?

The coverage states that Commander PACAF is advocating an E-7 buy now but the USAF Chief isn’t ready to commit just yet, he wants to look at other options.

Thunder wrote: ↑

Thu Sep 23, 2021 3:16 pm

EGVP wrote: ↑

Thu Sep 23, 2021 1:18 pm

Hmm I think that needs a thread of its own, I'm not sure where the USAF are going to get donor airframes from in the numbers they'll need!

Not sure if they are the same frame base, but SouthWest are currently retiring over 100 -700’s variants of the B737.

I thought the 3rd one for the RAF is a new build, with just the first two being from the second hand market to speed up the delivery process?

Correct
1st arrived at STS Aviation Services - 7 January 2021 Boeing 737-73W (BBJ1) Registration N946BC (construction number 38633/3329) former Deer Jet
2nd will be another circa 8-10 year old Aircraft
3rd This will be the quandary in that this was supposed to be a new build along with Frames 4 & 5.
With the reduction in fleet to 3 and so many airframes sitting around my bet is we don't have a new build but go for an existing airframe to save costs.

Boeing needs all the money it can get these days - if the USAF wants to buy some Boeing aircraft it'll offer what the USAF wants.

Ghost from above wrote: ↑

Sun Sep 26, 2021 10:09 am

Correct
1st arrived at STS Aviation Services - 7 January 2021 Boeing 737-73W (BBJ1) Registration N946BC (construction number 38633/3329) former Deer Jet
2nd will be another circa 8-10 year old Aircraft
3rd This will be the quandary in that this was supposed to be a new build along with Frames 4 & 5.
With the reduction in fleet to 3 and so many airframes sitting around my bet is we don't have a new build but go for an existing airframe to save costs.

I thought the 2nd aircraft was delivered to STS at Birmingham recently? It is N947BC (construction number 40117/3701) according to Aerodata, which first flew on 25 Jun 2011.

HTH

FF

N947BC arrived Birmingham 16/09/2021.

I always envisaged the USAF selecting a sort of a Boeing 767 AEW type AIrcraft?

Yep they tried that and binned the project decades ago.

EGVP wrote: ↑

Sun Sep 26, 2021 12:22 pm

Yep they tried that and binned the project decades ago.

Japan have four 767 AWACS though.

Nighthawke wrote: ↑

Sun Sep 26, 2021 11:29 am

N947BC arrived Birmingham 16/09/2021.

Ah crap, missed it. Thanks for the clarification tho.

You need to remember that the Southwest B737-700's are standard airline machines. A 737-BBJ 700 series has the fuselage of a standard 737-700 but the wing of a 737-800. Both of the aircraft undergoing conversion at BHX are former BBJ's.

With the USAF now operating the KC-46 (a version of the 767) an aircraft based on that airframe may be more attractive now than when first mooted.

Given all the issues with the KC-46.... I suspect the USAF might not be a happy end customer for another version of that.....?

Unknown74 wrote: ↑

Sun Sep 26, 2021 12:17 pm

I always envisaged the USAF selecting a sort of a Boeing 767 AEW type AIrcraft?

Thing is, why would you go to the expense of design and build and testing and certification and setting up infrastructure for a new type, when a type that works and is in service already exists? the Japanese 767's AWACS are quite old now and the design wouldn't (I suspect) form the basis of any new design 767 AWACS model. The future is, like the E-7, AESA radar too, so no carry over from the radar dome and attachment.

aren't most of the issues with the refuelling capability and not the aircraft itself ?

yes I agree AESA will be more prevalent over having moving parts on and airframe

steamy wrote: ↑

Mon Sep 27, 2021 10:01 am

aren't most of the issues with the refuelling capability and not the aircraft itself ?

yes I agree AESA will be more prevalent over having moving parts on and airframe

ISTAR aircraft use an awful lot of electrical power. If the USAF are happy to buy the E-7 as it currently is, then fine. But if they start adding on a shopping list of other wish list stuff they'll end up having to upgrade lots of electrical generator and distribution equipment, and that's very costly. Usually better to start with an airframe that has that electrical capacity already, and then add the electronics. It's one of the reasons the new AF-1's will be 747-800 based, and I expect the E-4 replacement to go the same way. E6 replacements might also go 747-800 if they decide 4 engine survivability is more important than 2 engine cost savings. They'll have to pull their fingers out though if they want to go that way because supply of suitable 747 airframes won't last forever.

I didn't even think of that, I just had my "civil ETOPS 2 engines are fine " cap on...

747 would be a more logical choice for some platforms