FighterControl

G-XATW arrived at Stansted from Norwich on Friday evening in RAF/Vespina colours. I'd imagine this will work alongside ZZ336 on domestic and short haul trips. I believe its being leased from Titan Airways.

Image https://twitter.com/SPD_travels/status/ ... 96865?s=20

FR24 track https://www.flightradar24.com/data/aircraft/g-xatw

One to keep an eye on in the future now.

Seems a lot more useful than the A330, plenty of range and decent capacity without being huge in size or op costs. I can see this being used for 95% of flights including trans-Atlantic.

Maybe a couple of A220 ACJs would be a good replacement for the 146s.. ? Throw a bit of wing work to Belfast too!

Wonder if this will be re registered on the military register? And wonder where it will be based as the RAF were looking into getting rid of Northolt not too long ago.

thevulcan wrote: ↑

Sun Mar 21, 2021 12:36 pm

Wonder if this will be re registered on the military register? And wonder where it will be based as the RAF were looking into getting rid of Northolt not too long ago.

Stansted?

The second one has just been registered as G-GBNI, for Great Britain & Northern Ireland. So I can see this being used by the RAF also. I presume the first one, G-XATW, stood for Across all the world? Will these be based at Brize Norton?

Article on the matter below.
https://ukdefencejournal.org.uk/uk-appe ... transport/

B-2 Fan wrote: ↑

Sun Mar 21, 2021 4:26 pm

The second one has just been registered as G-GBNI, for Great Britain & Northern Ireland. So I can see this being used by the RAF also. I presume the first one, G-XATW, stood for Across all the world? Will these be based at Brize Norton?

G-XATW was registered for TCS World Travel and was nothing to do with the UK government.

G-GBNI was originally due to be registered G-OATW, so I'd expect to see this first one reregistered at some point.

Bit heavy compared with the BAE146’s surely.

Yes double near enough but how or why is that significant if it does the job better all round?

You can get a 146, with it's defensive aids, in and out of a heck of a lot more places than an A321.

EGVP wrote: ↑

Sun Mar 21, 2021 9:17 pm

You can get a 146, with it's defensive aids, in and out of a heck of a lot more places than an A321.

Trouble is, they cost A LOT. Read somewhere the 146s cost £6,700 an hour to fly. In comparison, a Voyager costs £2,000 an hour to fly. And we know the differences in size and range with those... That can accumulate very quickly.

Oh I understand that, but there are far better options than a couple of A321neoLR!

Without knowing the answer but a fairly educated guess both these a/c will be based at Stansted with the owner Titan Airways and neither will be put on the Military register ,
the aircraft are being used by UK Govt for VIP missions not by the RAF (Although they may be used I guess for high ranking officers who need to go to other countries)
Stansted would be the best place for them anyway as only an hour outside London where most the passengers will come from

a better picture here https://www.skyliner-aviation.de/viewph ... icid=10678

note no RAF titles

also with regards to the registrations when G-GBNI is delivered would XATW not revert back to Titan use , as I cant see anything to say two aircraft are to be contracted ?

my thoughts on the matter anyway

Correct, these will be not be operated by the RAF.

thevulcan wrote: ↑

Sun Mar 21, 2021 12:36 pm

Wonder if this will be re registered on the military register? And wonder where it will be based as the RAF were looking into getting rid of Northolt not too long ago.

Can't see any reason to put it on the military register as a one off. Beleive it will be based at Northolt, which (currently) has no plans to close.

Aircraft are reportedly being "Wet Leased"

A wet lease is a leasing arrangement whereby one airline (the lessor) provides an aircraft, complete crew, maintenance, and insurance (ACMI) to another airline or other type of business acting as a broker of air travel (the lessee), which pays by hours operated. The lessee provides fuel and covers airport fees, and any other duties, taxes, etc. The flight uses the flight number of the lessee. A wet lease generally lasts 1–24 months.

so with this in mind why would the MOD/UK Govt or Titan want to base the aircraft anywhere other than at Stansted their home base where all the above currently are available at effectively no cost

Part of the lease will involve the aircraft positioning to Northolt to operate flights , but I cannot see them physically living at Northolt

happy to be proven wrong if anybody has any definitive information

pg1610 wrote: ↑

Mon Mar 22, 2021 11:51 am

Aircraft are reportedly being "Wet Leased"

A wet lease is a leasing arrangement whereby one airline (the lessor) provides an aircraft, complete crew, maintenance, and insurance (ACMI) to another airline or other type of business acting as a broker of air travel (the lessee), which pays by hours operated. The lessee provides fuel and covers airport fees, and any other duties, taxes, etc. The flight uses the flight number of the lessee. A wet lease generally lasts 1–24 months.

so with this in mind why would the MOD/UK Govt or Titan want to base the aircraft anywhere other than at Stansted their home base where all the above currently are available at effectively no cost

Part of the lease will involve the aircraft positioning to Northolt to operate flights , but I cannot see them physically living at Northolt

happy to be proven wrong if anybody has any definitive information

Depends what one means by "basing" (no disrespect to you who seems to understand what leasing is about). I guess there will be a line maintenance function at Northolt where the aircraft will operate from, and they'll position to Stansted for scheduled maintenance.

pg1610 wrote: ↑

Mon Mar 22, 2021 11:51 am

Aircraft are reportedly being "Wet Leased"

A wet lease is a leasing arrangement whereby one airline (the lessor) provides an aircraft, complete crew, maintenance, and insurance (ACMI) to another airline or other type of business acting as a broker of air travel (the lessee), which pays by hours operated. The lessee provides fuel and covers airport fees, and any other duties, taxes, etc. The flight uses the flight number of the lessee. A wet lease generally lasts 1–24 months.

so with this in mind why would the MOD/UK Govt or Titan want to base the aircraft anywhere other than at Stansted their home base where all the above currently are available at effectively no cost

Part of the lease will involve the aircraft positioning to Northolt to operate flights , but I cannot see them physically living at Northolt

happy to be proven wrong if anybody has any definitive information

That’s interesting that! So what happens after the 2 years? Can it be renewed? Will Titan just repaint it in their usual scheme and just go about their business? Will the RAF buy it then?
I do think that Northolt makes more sense that Stansted which, for one, isn’t in London! Unless of course it’s flown over to NHT when it’s needed to. Presumably it can land there?

Titan operate a small fleet of aircraft available for private hire, and longer term leasing. The big travel companies (TUI) often use them to supply aircraft on peak weeks of the summer and winter holiday season. I've flown on a Titan operated B757 on a ski trip which was supposedly a Tompson flight, and also on one of their B737 on a Snow jet flight. They also used to operate some of the Falklands air bridge flights from Brize with a B767 (IIRC) before Airtanker were ready.

My bet is that it, and it's crew, will spend 99.9% of it's time at Stansted where Titan are based, the servicing is available, and presumably the crews live. It'll just hop down to Northolt to pick up/drop off PAX as and when required before coming/going to wherever. They'll need ground handling at Northolt, but assuming the plane stays serviceable shouldn't need much maintainace - no more that at any of the toilets that TUI fly to anyway - Chambery are you listening :-)