FighterControl

Air USA are buying up to 46 A and B model F-18's from the RAAF.
These will be serviced and prepared over the next three to four years at Williamtown

This should some similar aircraft adversary training rather than the the current European mix types offered.

Full article here.
https://theaviationgeekclub.com/air-usa ... -fighters/

Even the mighty US DoD relying on contractors now!? Why is it cheaper to have these civilian operated jets instead of a couple of proper USAF or USN squadrons flying them?

Same with the RAF and its Voyagers. Why can't they just be operated solely by the RAF and not 'Air tanker ltd'?

Not having a dig at those companies, I'm sure they're very professional, just how are they any cheaper to run than by the military? Is it just to save tax payers' money so gain politicians' more votes?

Because with those civilian contractors, you only pay for the hours you use them? I suppose owning those aircraft and sitting idle on the ramps when not using them might be more expensive.

I would imagine that all possible cost incursions have been looked at and are already covered in the initial contract prices(especially Airtanker).With these contractors operating at profit then there is no way that the cost of these contracts can be cheaper over the duration than just buying the capability outright. Only benefit is you aren’t paying for the capability in one go at the outset but over a contractual period.

IIRC correctly the Airtanker concept will cost the British taxpayer roughly four times the amount of money over the lifetime of the program than it would if the MOD had bought the tankers outright from the start? That would have meant paying for them at the time though rather than spreading the cost over the lifetime.

I wonder how many MOD officials from the time now work for Airtanker lol or is that just the cynic in me

As for the American system, who knows?! Their military continue to purchase aircraft just because a Senator from one state has more sway than others...

Regards

Mark

One would think that maybe due to the pilot shortage. Less pilots to train for for the military and activate the squadrons etc. And I'm sure most are retired military pilots anyway opting to stay near home and not fly for the airlines. Just a thought.

For those that seem to have forgotten, Draken International were asked to start providing initial ACMI/DACT aircraft for training shortly after the USAF disbanded the 65th AGRS with F-15s at Nellis. Due in no small part to the issues they were having with an increasingly smaller, and no less ageing fleet.

So to answer the question asked by Cyberfox. That's why the US DoD decided to buy/contract time. Instead of the.....Why struggle to maintain increasing worn out Eagles.

Vulcanone wrote: ↑

Sun Mar 08, 2020 5:21 pm

So to answer the question asked by Cyberfox. That's why the US DoD decided to buy/contract time. Instead of the.....Why struggle to maintain increasing worn out Eagles.

I don't understand why you came up with that, as these aircraft where transferred to the ANG and other units

Maybe the 65th AGRS jets did go to the ANG, I can't remember that far back. The entire F-15 fleet was still shrinking at the time, from memory.

I believe they went to Montana or was it Calif. As I do remembered one of the units had the camo scheme on some of there jets. If I'm not mistaken. I'm just a photographer not a spotter

So like many things in many governments it sounds like these are all short termist policies designed to get a few million off next year's balance sheet rather than delivering the best value to taxpayers.

No its a long term contracting policy otherwise why would Draken, ATAC, Air USA and so on have bothered investing a shed load of cash in surplus. French Spanish Mirage F1s and other companies buying more.

f106dart wrote: ↑

Sun Mar 08, 2020 11:00 pm

I believe they went to Montana or was it Calif. As I do remembered one of the units had the camo scheme on some of there jets. If I'm not mistaken. I'm just a photographer not a spotter

At least two F-15Cs: 78-504 (blue colour scheme) and 78-0480 (brown colour scheme) were reassigned to the California Air National Guard's 194th Fighter Squadron/144th Fighter Wing

Richard E wrote: ↑

Tue Mar 10, 2020 9:58 am

f106dart wrote: ↑

Sun Mar 08, 2020 11:00 pm

I believe they went to Montana or was it Calif. As I do remembered one of the units had the camo scheme on some of there jets. If I'm not mistaken. I'm just a photographer not a spotter

At least two F-15Cs: 78-504 (blue colour scheme) and 78-0480 (brown colour scheme) were reassigned to the California Air National Guard's 194th Fighter Squadron/144th Fighter Wing

I know they went somewhere. Just wasn't sure where

For those that didn't grasp the reasoning behind all of this

USAF Video 2015 Original Draken trial post F-15 AGRS disbandment

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_cont ... e=emb_logo

And the VP of Draken explains all at Farnborough 2016

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VXCujJs ... e=emb_logo

Its a bit like a company using agency staff. For example the agency supply your company with a cleaner everyday for 3 hours. Things run smoothly till one day cleaner is sick. You dont have to worry about replacing the cleaner [or in most cases letting the mess build up till cleaner returns] , or even paying cleaners sick pay. Agency just sends somebody else to do the job.
This is the same with contracting out. Plus with certain contracts a penalty clause is built in meaning if you dont provide the goods. You have to pay money to the contractee. Doubt this would happen in the UK. Government would just keep throwing money into the Aerospace company pocket

Kurnass wrote: ↑

Sun Mar 08, 2020 7:28 am

Because with those civilian contractors, you only pay for the hours you use them? I suppose owning those aircraft and sitting idle on the ramps when not using them might be more expensive.

Would you buy a new car outright if you had the money and wanted one for 10 years, or would you rent hire one or use a taxi.

Pay £300 a month for 10 years for one car = £36,000 car. Pay £300 a month for PCP deals on three year terms, four news cars each worth £36,000?