FighterControl

How shocking is this...Sacked for driving an official car (Ford Galaxy) outside of official duties, because he was never made aware that it's not allowed - he even paid for the petrol!!

https://news.sky.com/story/hms-queen-el ... s-11722043

As I have remarked elsewhere, Goodbye Sailor... The guy may have been guilty of an error of judgement, but does the punishment fit the crime? I think not... Surely, an admonishment would have been sufficient? Have we now become so petty as to wreck a man's career for this? Greatly saddened this morning...

It's atrocious, isn't it? The poor bloke didn't know - So just tell him surely?? Then the issue is resolved. What a bad image this'll paint for the Royal Navy.

James Cutting wrote: ↑

Fri May 17, 2019 10:37 am

How shocking is this...Sacked for driving an official car (Ford Galaxy) outside of official duties, because he was never made aware that it's not allowed - he even paid for the petrol!!

https://news.sky.com/story/hms-queen-el ... s-11722043

That’s rubbish. Every service person driving service vehicles will know, and have signed orders, that a service vehicle can only be used for a personal journey (such as to commute home) under a very specific set of circumstances.

For a Captain to say he was “never made aware” is laughable. Or he’s very naive and been grossly over-promoted.

mad dan eccles wrote: ↑

Fri May 17, 2019 10:44 am

As I have remarked elsewhere, Goodbye Sailor... The guy may have been guilty of an error of judgement, but does the punishment fit the crime? I think not... Surely, an admonishment would have been sufficient? Have we now become so petty as to wreck a man's career for this? Greatly saddened this morning...

Doesn’t set a good example to the personnel under his command though, does it?

“Why did you break the law sailor?”

“Oh, just like the skipper, I didn’t know. No one told me”.

No defence.

You seem like you know the ins and outs of it pretty well!

Either way, it's a very extreme measure for something so small.

As always with these things, one shouldn't jump to conclusions so soon, or take the reports at face value, I think even the RN wouldn't comment due to ongoing investigations.

I wouldn't be surprised if there was perhaps more to this than reported.

Agreed there

Got to agree with ColintheCaterpillar. Orders would have been signed and he would’ve been fully aware of what he was doing and obviously not setting a good example to those under him at the same time. I work for the NHS nowadays and we aren’t allowed to drive our vehicles outside of work purposes either, if we do it’s an instant dismissal offence. Also for all we know there may other matters that we don’t know about.

If you read the article is states that he has been reassigned and sacked, so which is it?

I guess so - Information is limited at the moment, so we can only go off what's been "reported". Interesting to see how it pans out, though.

James Cutting wrote: ↑

Fri May 17, 2019 10:58 am

You seem like you know the ins and outs of it pretty well!

Either way, it's a very extreme measure for something so small.

I have a service driving license, and have had to sit and read the orders at every single unit I’ve served...

...which is why the “no one told me” line doesn’t add up.

Service discipline is a lot harsher than say that in civilian life, or that applying to MPs.

He has been relieved of his command of HMS Queen Elizabeth, not the same as being sacked, but still a 'black mark' on his career.
See BBC News here: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-48310522

Fair enough Colin - I understand what you are saying. If found guilty then I agree something should be done I just feel sacking is a bit OTT!

He hasn’t been sacked, that’s the sensationalist journo’s take on it, for headline purposes.

He has been relieved of command of HMS Elizabeth, he is still an officer in the Royal Navy.

As above, nobody who has ever driven a service vehicle can be in any doubt about what the rules are...

In fact, I suspect you’d be in more trouble persisting with the line that you didn’t know the rules despite signing umpteen times conforming you did.

When I took the Queens shilling many many years ago, as a lowly airman, one of the first things we learnt was that "Dont know" "Didnt know" "No one told me" are not valid excuses in the eyes of the law, both civil and military,(That still holds today) for an officer to say that is complete and utter bullpatty. Sacked means just that as far as I'm aware, its off to civvy street, being still in the navy doing something else is not sacked!

I cant be bothered to read the story i'd say its purely click bait to get more views sell more papers etc etc.

Called 'The rule of ignorance' during my Service days.
Does seem harsh, however in his position, standards etc...
Many Senior Officers also had personal drivers who picked up/returned vehicles.

Dont you think the many months working on the carrier gave him a great deal of knowledge of the ship,so who now on the ship has the same knowledge to run it as well as the guy who got the chop. ? rob

Tooks wrote: ↑

Fri May 17, 2019 1:16 pm

He hasn’t been sacked, that’s the sensationalist journo’s take on it, for headline purposes.

He has been relieved of command of HMS Elizabeth, he is still an officer in the Royal Navy.

As above, nobody who has ever driven a service vehicle can be in any doubt about what the rules are...

In fact, I suspect you’d be in more trouble persisting with the line that you didn’t know the rules despite signing umpteen times conforming you did.

Facts don’t sell papers, and the truth is nowhere near as interesting as him getting sacked. The gutter press in this country make me feel ill!!

Wes...

Hunter49 wrote: ↑

Fri May 17, 2019 7:12 pm

Dont you think the many months working on the carrier gave him a great deal of knowledge of the ship,so who now on the ship has the same knowledge to run it as well as the guy who got the chop. ? rob

The person under him for starters, at the end of the day he is only one person in a crew of several hundred.

Thunder wrote: ↑

Fri May 17, 2019 8:56 pm

Hunter49 wrote: ↑

Fri May 17, 2019 7:12 pm

Dont you think the many months working on the carrier gave him a great deal of knowledge of the ship,so who now on the ship has the same knowledge to run it as well as the guy who got the chop. ? rob

The person under him for starters, at the end of the day he is only one person in a crew of several hundred.

And it’s reported he has been replaced by the Captain of sister ship Prince of Wales.

So, as good a replacement as you can get, and no different really to someone taking over on the normal 2-3 year tour.