RAF Mildenhall to close. Lakenheath to get F-35 by 2020

[Thunder]

Good to see that we’re still being dictated by the US.

[baz1]

yes and it will still close.

[filmman]

Meanwhile, the USA Presidential elections loom. Will it be a second coming. And afterwards there could be a fundamental Political/Defence review. Seem to remember Beiden went to Ukraine etc,. China ain't the flavor of the year and did the French build something in Wuh...result I would not bet either way on Mildenhall, so enjoy and await page 100.
Filmman

[page_verify]

The basing of F-35s at Lakenheath is the latest pawn in this game. If Trump wins a second term then I can see him doing everything he can do to turn the heat up on China: trade tariffs, restrict the use of Huawei technology, and focus his armed forces on the Pacific theatre. Unfortunately for the UK, we need a post-Brexit trade deal with the US that may have to have detrimental China-related clauses in it, we need a 5G network, and we need access to the F-35 aircraft and facilities to support our own armed forces. Oh dear.

https://www.military.com/daily-news/202 ... ports.html

[Reach1985]

The basing of F-35s at Lakenheath is the latest pawn in this game. If Trump wins a second term then I can see him doing everything he can do to turn the heat up on China: trade tariffs, restrict the use of Huawei technology, and focus his armed forces on the Pacific theatre. Unfortunately for the UK, we need a post-Brexit trade deal with the US that may have to have detrimental China-related clauses in it, we need a 5G network, and we need access to the F-35 aircraft and facilities to support our own armed forces. Oh dear.

https://www.military.com/daily-news/202 ... ports.html

Hi Page Verify, there’s been further news on this since this story broke - see my earlier post. It looks likely that the involvement of Huawei in the UK 5G network is being reviewed w/ the aim that by 2023 they have no part in it.

[dotwatcher01]

The basing of F-35s at Lakenheath is no pawn: "“...(Flight, July 2019)... an exciting milestone for the (USAF’s 48th Fighter Wing) as we prepare this installation to welcome two squadrons of F-35A Lightning II aircraft and supporting personnel,” says Colonel William Marshall, commander of the 48th Fighter Wing. “Breaking ground on this project takes us one step closer to becoming a more lethal and ready force as US Air Forces in Europe and Air Forces Africa’s premier combat wing.”

RAF Lakenheath is the largest USAF-operated base in the UK and the only Boeing F-15 fighter wing within US Air Forces in Europe. The fighter wing consists of more than 4,500 active-duty military members, plus more than 1,000 British and US civilians."

Whomsoever is The President for the next four years wont make much difference, we wont get F-111s back in the UK and that's a fact:-(

[James Cutting]

Amazing this whole Huawei business even became linked to the military network. They weren't even going to have a massive part in our infrastructure, just the RAN (Radio Access Network).

Even so, even if Huawei were involved they wouldn't be touching the military infrastructure, as it is on it's own network/infrastructure, similarly like the emergency services is.

Nothing like a bit of US "fake news" and scaremongering about "pulling some planes out".

[page_verify]

The basing of F-35s at Lakenheath is the latest pawn in this game. If Trump wins a second term then I can see him doing everything he can do to turn the heat up on China: trade tariffs, restrict the use of Huawei technology, and focus his armed forces on the Pacific theatre. Unfortunately for the UK, we need a post-Brexit trade deal with the US that may have to have detrimental China-related clauses in it, we need a 5G network, and we need access to the F-35 aircraft and facilities to support our own armed forces. Oh dear.

https://www.military.com/daily-news/202 ... ports.html

Hi Page Verify, there’s been further news on this since this story broke - see my earlier post. It looks likely that the involvement of Huawei in the UK 5G network is being reviewed w/ the aim that by 2023 they have no part in it.

Sorry, pasted the wrong link - there's a US senator who says the UK won't remove its Huawei kit fast enough for his liking and wants to penalise the UK for that.

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/huaw ... -x593zppg7

[F4JPhantomII]

Here's the article page_verify shared for those who don't have a Times subscription:

China is “attempting to drive a high-tech wedge” between Britain and the United States using Huawei, an American senator has told MPs.

Tom Cotton, a Republican from Arkansas, yesterday claimed that US combat jets and aircrew based in Britain would face a “dangerous risk” if the government pressed ahead with plans to allow Huawei to help to develop the 5G mobile network.

The senator, a critic of China, warned that the move could force Washington to withdraw military aircraft and personnel from UK bases, redeploying them to the western Pacific where the threat was considered “more severe”.

The US air force has about 50 F-15 fighter jets based at RAF Lakenheath in Suffolk, along with Osprey helicopters. It also has C-130 Hercules military transport aircraft stationed at nearby RAF Mildenhall. Next year the US is set to deploy 48 F-35 fighter jets to the UK, a move Mr Cotton has said he will block if Britain goes ahead with Huawei technology in its mobile network upgrade.

The senator told the Commons defence sub-committee that US experts had warned that “Huawei could help China gain damaging information about how air crews fight, to personal info about our airmen. Our fighters in England are armed with munitions by ground crews using special lanyards [the cable that arms a weapon when it is launched] shipped from the US. Those are transported by shipping companies operating on commercial networks. If that network includes Huawei 5G, it could give PLA [People’s Liberation Army] hackers a window into military operations.”

Mr Cotton, 43, said he was not speaking on behalf of the Trump administration, but emphasised that his views were shared in Washington.

Huawei has always denied it poses a security risk and insists it is a private, employee-owned company, free from state influence.

Commenting on draft proposals drawn up by British officials to set a 2023 deadline after which the installation of new Huawei equipment would be banned, Mr Cotton said: “I would urge you to do so even earlier.”

[skysearcher]

trump has apparently directed US EUCOM to remover nearly a quarter of the troops stationed in Germany - on the Dday anniversary weekend.
Troops and an F-16 squadron have been cited as moving to Poland. Given the current geo-political instability Im thinking RAFM will be here for a while yet!

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/06/05/worl ... rmany.html

[Brave New World]

trump has apparently directed US EUCOM to remover nearly a quarter of the troops stationed in Germany - on the Dday anniversary weekend.
Troops and an F-16 squadron have been cited as moving to Poland. Given the current geo-political instability Im thinking RAFM will be here for a while yet!

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/06/05/worl ... rmany.html

Exactly -

The fact that Germany will now have a cap of 25,000 US Service Personnel mean that the closure sand transfer of units from Mildenhall to Germany is now a non-starter.

The US Forces are going to struggle with the 25,000 cap now in place without making the situation worse by transferring further units.

[CHINOOKER]

BNW...I hope you are correct in your assumptions!. However, is it not possible that the new figure of 25,000 actually includes all the personnel transferred from Mildenhall etc?.

[TonyO]

In evidence given by a Senator Tom Cotton to the UK Defence Committee last week, he says in there that he "introduced legislation and halted a planned withdrawal of forces from RAF Mildenhall."

Make of that what you will.

[Kurnass]

It all depends on what happens in Trumps mind. Today he wants to pull out 9.500 troops out of Germany. Maybe next week he wants to add 20.000? With that guy you can never know. And if he is still in power after november, no one knows. So don’t jump to any conclusions yet.

[page_verify]

The decision to close Mildenhall was a long-term (20 year programme of work to implement) apolitical decision, rather than one of Trump's immediate interests that he tries to use to show his power over everything. Similarly, the changes to US personnel moving around Europe and out of Germany have been planned for several years, they just haven't been released to the media or been of interest to the public until recently. What Trump should've said was "a decision made several years ago by other people is now happening and I had no involvement in it" but he doesn't say things like that does he?

Nonetheless, I believe there were too many assumptions made about how easily Mildenhall could be closed and therefore money saved. I suspect someone assumed that as Mildenhall was found to have no unique features during the European basing review that its missions could be relocated for next to nothing. The savings aren't there any more so it won't close, is my guess.

[page_verify]

In evidence given by a Senator Tom Cotton to the UK Defence Committee last week, he says in there that he "introduced legislation and halted a planned withdrawal of forces from RAF Mildenhall."

Make of that what you will.

Senator Cotton was the chap in the Huawei story I posted last week, he's known for proposing all kinds of whacky legislation that never gets approved so doesn't see the light of day.

[page_verify]

BNW...I hope you are correct in your assumptions!. However, is it not possible that the new figure of 25,000 actually includes all the personnel transferred from Mildenhall etc?.

The devil is in the detail, the 34,000 troops to 25,000 quote can almost certainly only refer to US Army personnel, not USAF.

While Wikipedia may not always be stunning correct, this paragraph is quite telling:
"Ramstein AB is part of the Kaiserslautern Military Community (KMC), where more than 54,000 American service members and more than 5,400 US civilian employees live and work. U.S. organizations in the KMC also employ the services of more than 6,200 German workers. Air Force units in the KMC alone employ almost 9,800 military members, bringing with them nearly 11,100 family members. There are more than 16,200 military, U.S. civilian and U.S. contractors assigned to Ramstein AB alone. "

[Brave New World]

BNW...I hope you are correct in your assumptions!. However, is it not possible that the new figure of 25,000 actually includes all the personnel transferred from Mildenhall etc?.

According to the US, they often have as many as 50,000 plus personnel in the US due to rotations and other factors, so they are going to struggle with a 25,000 cap without adding further forces transferred from other countries.

Trump is also not going to want anything transferred to Germany.

As for the fighter squadron being moved it will most likely be the F-16's of thr 480th from Spangdahlem, and the future of Spangdahlem may now be uncertain.

The 480th are most likelyto go to Aviano with the rest of the F-16's or even to Poland.

[Brave New World]

BNW...I hope you are correct in your assumptions!. However, is it not possible that the new figure of 25,000 actually includes all the personnel transferred from Mildenhall etc?.

The devil is in the detail, the 34,000 troops to 25,000 quote can almost certainly only refer to US Army personnel, not USAF.

While Wikipedia may not always be stunning correct, this paragraph is quite telling:
"Ramstein AB is part of the Kaiserslautern Military Community (KMC), where more than 54,000 American service members and more than 5,400 US civilian employees live and work. U.S. organizations in the KMC also employ the services of more than 6,200 German workers. Air Force units in the KMC alone employ almost 9,800 military members, bringing with them nearly 11,100 family members. There are more than 16,200 military, U.S. civilian and U.S. contractors assigned to Ramstein AB alone. "

I suggest you look at the number of US Forces in Germany, which has 20,774 US Army personnel, with the 2nd Cavalry being the main front line combat unit, the other being the 173rd Airborne which is mainly in Italy.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_St ... nts#Europe

[page_verify]

Interesting, thank you for your more up-to-date numbers.

If Spang closes, then Mildenhall will almost certainly have to remain open. Spang was upgraded in the mid-to-late 2000s to have a large air mobility surge capacity to replace Rhine-Main AB's ability to support large no-notice global mobility needs.