Duxford incident?

[cottesmore09]

By the way the Flying Legends is going we won't have warbirds left in the skies of britain! How can so many incidents happen at one show, 1 is bad enough not 3 of them. I find it hard to believe any ATC etc was there at all, Was the Mustang down for RIAT?

[garethbrum]

Was the Mustang down for RIAT?

That is of no consequence whatsoever.

[cottesmore09]

Yes i know but i would of liked to see the Mustang as a few. But the main point is could the event been controlled alittle better in the air?

I don't know what went on but it all sounds abit of a mess.

[Richard B]

Few clips on youtube from Duxford today.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qME7VefLxFw" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ciMaBKhgAGQ" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[headset 57]

As for those on about ATC control, Duxford do not have Air Traffic Control and display directors and display pilots know a damn sight more about displaying safely than air traffic controllers!!

They do have ATC, I know as I have been lucky to have landed there as P2. If they didnt have ATC on the day then any old pilot could fly into the middle of an airshow.

Anuff of that, just happy to hear that pilots and viewers are all ok.

Actually they DON'T!, It's an AFISO service with ground control only, and up to the pilots to see & avoid in the circuit, it is not a ATC Tower as such, but is referred to by all...

Pilots 'can' fly into an airshow circuit but that's what notams are for...

Crash crews have 3 minutes to get to any part of the airfield during an emergency so 60 second is far better than average, considering they had 2 incidents aircraft to deal with.They can't just go whizzing around amongst live movements and they also need a clear crash grid reference for the downed plane.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1JVYYKF4ZaI" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[Sheff]

That is of no consequence whatsoever.

It is to anyone who wanted to see it. How rude.

[XPLUMBER]

By the way the Flying Legends is going we won't have warbirds left in the skies of britain! How can so many incidents happen at one show, 1 is bad enough not 3 of them. I find it hard to believe any ATC etc was there at all, Was the Mustang down for RIAT?

Perhaps the number of crashes at Duxford could be attributed to the HIGH number of warbirds the show attracts, ALL of the other shows have a few warbirds, Duxford has nothing but warbirds!

Hugely saddened by this incident, BUT massively gladdened that both Aircrew are alive!

[garyscott]

I think its quite saddening that when a thread in a similar vein to this appears that it always (lately) descends into mud slinging and 'i know better/more than you'itus.
Our greatest strength is that COLLECTIVELY we know a great deal about all things aviation. Its not tit for tat.
There was an accident. Thank god no-body was seriously injured or at worst, killed. A great airframe has been (i reckon) lost.
People can bang on about "its too many crashes" etc but planes do arrive at terra firma quite often at a greater rate of knots than they are insured for.
Its saddening and very often tragic.

This is a forum where we all enjoy a love of aviation. Why does it have to go down with rants, sniping comments and one-upmanship?
There are plenty of other forums that can cater for a need to bare fangs and flex your muscles.


This isnt it.


I would much rather entertain a grown up, friendly (i thought we all were?) conversation about a subject, more than see comments bandied about of the type you would see at kicking out time at the local moshpit.

[vinnyboy]

Yes i agree. But without sounding horrible as i am in a airshow committee I have noticed of late that about 80% of people go to airshows to hope for an incident like this so they can get pics etc. OK i know its sick but trust me this is what a lot of people would have wanted to see lots of incidents so they can brag about it. Obviously the guys on this forum are more genuine and like aviation but it just shows you what people are like these days All they want is to see a crash and thats horrible and im glad at duxford nobody was hurt in the air or on the ground.

[POL]

Isn't Duxford upgraded to full ATC on a show day? They were certainly giving aircraft circuit position earlier in the morning!

The DR.I ground-looped, as was already said, and I counted at least 2 minutes before the first emergency vehicle moved (I was stood at that end, I was counting!)

The French Skyraider was...interesting, to say the least! Seemed to turn in much later and much lower than normal, and ended up on the final for 24 with a Spitfire in front! Was his display called off? He certainly disappeared out East and didn't come back!

Didn't see the mid-air, so won't comment on that!

[Peter-S]

The trouble with most of these types of incidents is it brings out the ‘hindsight brigade’. They all know better after the event which doesn’t really help.
At the end of the day it was an accident. One of the pilots probably misjudjed/misunderstood and there was a collision. How many of us are immune to that sort of thing on the road. It always looks worse when it’s an aircraft especially and old warbird that we cherish but all these neigh Sayers were at the show, presumably because they like what Legends is all about.
Talking with Ed Shipley of the Horsemen on Saturday he was saying that the pilots had a 2 hour pre show briefing. Things are not taken lightly and usually it all works near to perfection. This time, sadly, it didn’t but we only lost a plane, not a life, on the far side of the field away from the public. It could have been worse but it wasn’t.

[BOLLO]

Blimey,some peeps don't mess about do they.

http://www.airliners.net/photo/Untitled ... 1949114/M/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[headset 57]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-ca ... e-14101641" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;



One of the planes, thought to be a P-51 Mustang, plummeted to the ground after their wings touched, forcing the pilot to parachute to safety.

The pilot of the other plane, a Skyraider, went on to land safely, after the military aircraft took to the air during the Flying Legends show.

No-one was injured in the accident during the show, near Duxford.

Mark Brown, a pilot from Warminster who was watching the show, said he saw a "large chunk" of the Skyraider's wing tip tear off in the collision.
'Fall from sky'

"It went into a bit of a dive then sorted itself out," he said. "The other aircraft dived away from the airfield. They were only about 100 feet up at this point.

"Then we saw someone jump out and a parachute open."

The P-51 Mustang hit the ground to the south-west of the Imperial War Museum at Duxford following the collision which is understood to have happened as three planes took part in formation manoeuvres.

One eyewitness said one of the planes seemed to "fall out of the sky".

"It seemed to be missing a bit of its wings," the witness said.

A spokesman for the organisers, the Imperial War Museum at Duxford, confirmed that both pilots were treated by paramedics at the scene.

"The cause of the incident will now be investigated by the Air Accident Investigation Branch (AAIB) and the museum is therefore not able to comment on the likely cause," he said.

The AAIB said it had been made aware of the crash and a team will be investigating.

[RichC]

Blimey,some peeps don't mess about do they.

http://www.airliners.net/photo/Untitled ... 1949114/M/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

And its blurry as hell, if i had put that up it would be rejected.

A new video of the incident including the wreckage of BBD
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OynscjUHzxg" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

It shows the Skyraider slightly overtaking the P-51 only to slow down, their wings miss each other only for the P-51s horizontal stabilizer chopping off the tip of the skyraiders wing.

[RichC]

Calm down Damien, you'll cream yourself in a minute accidentally.
The P-51 obviously suffered from some sort of control surface damage to spiral down out of control..... surely?

[Peter-S]

I agree with TSR2s view.

This image suggests the fuselage took the impact - looks bent to me so proabably the cable runs were screwed.

http://www.airshowbuzz.com/administrato ... /133333799" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[garyscott]

I agree with TSR2s view.

This image suggests the fuselage took the impact - looks bent to me so proabably the cable runs were screwed.

http://www.airshowbuzz.com/administrato ... /133333799" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I agree the cable runs may have been taken out, but the fuse isnt bent there, its missing a fairing that covers the tailwheel assembly and the vent for the injection glycol system.

[Malcolm]

Wasn't there- but - I have lisetned in to "pre-meditated ejections" on the radio. Once the pilot decides the situation is dire enough to eject/bail out (time permitting) they will try to point the aircraft in a safe direction (in this case away from the airshow and any obviously populated areas), and then close the throttle. This is to stop the plane flying on of it's own accord, and crashing god knows where. So the fact the plane "plummeted" after apparantly having "regained control" doesn't neccesserily mean the damage was what (directly) caused the plummiting.

At this stage only the pilot knows the full reasons for bailing out, and thankfully he is alive to tell the story to the accident investigators.

[Richard B]

Looking at some video, and it looks like the mustangs rear wing cut the wing tip off the skyraider. ?
hence cutting or jamming the lines and no way to climb etc,

[SamP]

Here is a still taken from the BBC Video of (as close as possible) the exact moment the two collided



It looks like the wing of the Skyraider struck the bottom of the rear fuselage of the Mustang (Either below the tail plane or just forward of it)

As has been said, I would imagine the cable controls to the Elevators and Rudder were either severed or jammed.

Looking back on my photo's the pilot of the Mustang ejected the canopy just seconds after the impact, textbook procedure on his part