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RAF to get F35A ?

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Doughnut
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Re: RAF to get F35A ?

Post by Doughnut » Mon Dec 30, 2024 9:11 pm

RAF need more Typhoon to simply replace the airframes being retired. The RAF has a very bad record regards maintaining and upgrading aircraft fleets and then suggesting they are too old and must be retired. The rest of Europe buying Typhoon keeps the jobs and technology in Europe. Not sure if the new AESA radar is a game changer but in any future conflict you need the numbers to be in the game.

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Agent K
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Re: RAF to get F35A ?

Post by Agent K » Tue Dec 31, 2024 8:38 am

Doughnut wrote:
Mon Dec 30, 2024 9:11 pm
RAF need more Typhoon to simply replace the airframes being retired. The RAF has a very bad record regards maintaining and upgrading aircraft fleets and then suggesting they are too old and must be retired. The rest of Europe buying Typhoon keeps the jobs and technology in Europe. Not sure if the new AESA radar is a game changer but in any future conflict you need the numbers to be in the game.
The RAF has what it needs, and this is what it has planned. You and I, however, and many others I'm sure believe that in the current environment it should have more. Maybe the upcoming SDR/SDSR will seek to address this.

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Ravendriver2008
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Re: RAF to get F35A ?

Post by Ravendriver2008 » Tue Dec 31, 2024 2:57 pm

slogen51 wrote:
Mon Dec 30, 2024 8:07 am
I think the Typhoon will see most of us out - nearly all the current operators of the Typhoon with the notable exception of the RAF have ordered additional batches to replace older tranche 1 models

In the Typhoon consortium Germany, Italy and Spain have all committed to additional orders. Also just reading an article describing how NATO are discussing long term upgrades to include new sensors and a Large Area Display (LAD) to enable better situation awareness for Typhoon pilots
The Eurofighter mock up which they have been bringing to the likes of DSTl in Setpember 2023, ILA Berlin back in June, Farnborough Air Show in July and Austrian Airpower in September has the new Large Area Display in it now. I know because I have sat in said mock up at all the shows.

It was also last year that BAE Systems selected Collins Aerospace to provide the LAD.

https://www.rtx.com/news/news-center/20 ... splay-prov

cheers

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cat1
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Re: RAF to get F35A ?

Post by cat1 » Thu Jan 23, 2025 5:24 pm

Apparently the F-35A is still in the running...

https://ukdefencejournal.org.uk/union-u ... hter-jets/

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Agent K
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Re: RAF to get F35A ?

Post by Agent K » Thu Jan 23, 2025 6:58 pm

I’d doubt very much that the union knows what is in the defence strategic plan, and also doubt that the F35 is in competition with the Typhoon for orders. Different aircraft, different missions and notably the F35 can’t carry some significant ordnance that the Typhoon can, especially that implemented under project Centurion.

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TonyO
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Re: RAF to get F35A ?

Post by TonyO » Fri Jan 24, 2025 6:49 pm

As mentioned in viewtopic.php?f=287&t=250531, the UK MoD has already said it plans to buy more F-35s to bring the fleet to 74 aircraft, for three front-line squadrons and that's how the combat aircraft fleet will be expanded. There is no mention yet of the F-35 version, but F-35Bs make the most sense, given that's what we already have.

As for UKDJ...
You want the Aladeen news, or the Aladeen news?

Vulcanone
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Re: RAF to get F35A ?

Post by Vulcanone » Fri Jan 24, 2025 7:20 pm

Yes TonyO their Facebook page seems full of twaddle..... With some interesting commentators trying to sink the idiots

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cat1
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Re: RAF to get F35A ?

Post by cat1 » Fri Jan 24, 2025 7:34 pm

Well apologies, I wasn't aware they weren't reliable

Guess I am now :lol:

RubyRoo
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Re: RAF to get F35A ?

Post by RubyRoo » Fri Jan 24, 2025 8:05 pm

27 more F-35B's is a given. That's the line that's come out of many official channels. Negotiations have been underway with Lockheed Martin for ages and the SDR is the perfect time to announce it. I appreciate it means very little until pen is put to paper but I'd say there is zero chance of the UK getting the A variant.

Best case scenario would be to commit to the 27 extra F-35B's to bring it up to 74 total as well as a Tranche 4 Typhoon order. I suspect that will be that until Tempest has a more defined timeline.

There's plenty of other major priorities the RAF has to contend with than fast jet numbers, namely:

- Hawk T1/T2 replacement
- Puma replacement programme needs urgent clarity.
- Additional A400Ms to partially offset the loss of Hercules. (This is in the equipment plan for 6 more, but again no official confirmation).
- Additional Wedgetails to get the original order of 5 back in business.
- Booms added to the Voyagers.
- More P-8s, ideally not all based at Lossiemouth.

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Thunder
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Re: RAF to get F35A ?

Post by Thunder » Fri Jan 24, 2025 8:52 pm

Considering all the infrastructure is at Lossie for the P-8, where else could you base them, outwith the usual FOB’s?

RubyRoo
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Re: RAF to get F35A ?

Post by RubyRoo » Fri Jan 24, 2025 8:58 pm

I agree that there would be major costs involved to have them based elsewhere, but Lossiemouth (and indeed Brize with the transport fleet) have all their eggs in one basket. I did say ideally! :)

If you want to go down fantasy land, put a squadron at St Mawgan to cover the south of the UK and Lossie to cover the north. ;)

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Thunder
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Re: RAF to get F35A ?

Post by Thunder » Fri Jan 24, 2025 9:36 pm

Ah yes, fantasy world.

27 F-35A, which would equate to two Sqns wouldn’t be a bad idea. Training and deep maintenance could be done in partnership with one or more of the other NATO members, I think Italy has a major servicing hub at Cameri. Going forward and with shrinking budgets across the entire NATO membership, interoperability is going to be key. However as has been mentioned before, you need to find pilots, engineers and all the rest of the support staff first, not to mention a suitable airfield, which will cost ££££’s.

Deramore
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Re: RAF to get F35A ?

Post by Deramore » Sat Jan 25, 2025 8:00 am

We used to protect Europe now they seem to be protecting us. The number of F35 deliveries is abysmal compared to many countries that ordered after us and but now have now had more units delivered.

Even getting to just 48 seems glacial.

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C24
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Re: RAF to get F35A ?

Post by C24 » Sat Jan 25, 2025 9:02 am

Thunder wrote:
Fri Jan 24, 2025 8:52 pm
Considering all the infrastructure is at Lossie for the P-8, where else could you base them, outwith the usual FOB’s?
Rotate them through Wittering and or Culdrose?
C24.
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Vulture 01
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Re: RAF to get F35A ?

Post by Vulture 01 » Sat Jan 25, 2025 12:50 pm

If I remember exactly, the original plan was for the P8 and Wedgetail to be based at Waddington. This made sense as it's the ISTAR hub.
If more f35's were ordered, would Leeming make a good place as a second hub?

No matter how we speculate, we'll not hear anything util those in charge see fit to tell us.

Alf
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Re: RAF to get F35A ?

Post by Alf » Sat Jan 25, 2025 1:40 pm

Vulture 01 wrote:
Sat Jan 25, 2025 12:50 pm
If I remember exactly, the original plan was for the P8 and Wedgetail to be based at Waddington. This made sense as it's the ISTAR hub.
If more f35's were ordered, would Leeming make a good place as a second hub?

No matter how we speculate, we'll not hear anything util those in charge see fit to tell us.
Yeovilton for the Navy F-35B squadrons, the base operated the Sea Harrier for many years without issues.

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cat1
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Re: RAF to get F35A ?

Post by cat1 » Sun Jan 26, 2025 7:21 am

Alf wrote:
Sat Jan 25, 2025 1:40 pm
Vulture 01 wrote:
Sat Jan 25, 2025 12:50 pm
If I remember exactly, the original plan was for the P8 and Wedgetail to be based at Waddington. This made sense as it's the ISTAR hub.
If more f35's were ordered, would Leeming make a good place as a second hub?

No matter how we speculate, we'll not hear anything util those in charge see fit to tell us.
Yeovilton for the Navy F-35B squadrons, the base operated the Sea Harrier for many years without issues.
A lot of the equipment required for operating fast jets was removed from RNAS Yeovilton a while ago I think.

Can anyone confirm?

Malcolm
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Re: RAF to get F35A ?

Post by Malcolm » Sun Jan 26, 2025 11:33 am

cat1 wrote:
Sun Jan 26, 2025 7:21 am
Alf wrote:
Sat Jan 25, 2025 1:40 pm
Vulture 01 wrote:
Sat Jan 25, 2025 12:50 pm
If I remember exactly, the original plan was for the P8 and Wedgetail to be based at Waddington. This made sense as it's the ISTAR hub.
If more f35's were ordered, would Leeming make a good place as a second hub?

No matter how we speculate, we'll not hear anything util those in charge see fit to tell us.
Yeovilton for the Navy F-35B squadrons, the base operated the Sea Harrier for many years without issues.
A lot of the equipment required for operating fast jets was removed from RNAS Yeovilton a while ago I think.

Can anyone confirm?
I've also heard from a usually reliable source that when the runway is resurfaced (next year?) they're going to reduce the declared length from the current 7500' to about 6500', so they can bring the ILS gear within the airfield boundary and stop paying the farmer rent money for the land that it occupies. Not a problem for F-35B, but will be an issue for some other types.

Vulcanone
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Re: RAF to get F35A ?

Post by Vulcanone » Sun Jan 26, 2025 11:34 am

I believe the runway crash barrier was, and Hawk or Sea Harrier ground equipment would certainly have been removed.

But as F-35s do overshoots there, and if needs be, them along with other types could presumably divert into VL if needs be then ????

EGDR
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Re: RAF to get F35A ?

Post by EGDR » Sun Jan 26, 2025 2:12 pm

If the idea is avoiding vulnerability (ie avoiding all eggs in one basket), putting F-35Bs at an airfield with no HASs wouldn't seem a particularly logical move to me. They'd also be miles away from the North Sea areas now most commonly used for fighter aircraft training. Doing TDYs or practice diversions is a very different beast to long term stationing.

As for St Mawgan, as much as I'd love to see it, the RAF has no proper airside access so a detachment of aircraft there would be at the whim of Newquay Airport and the MoD would likely have to cough up serious cash to cover the significant apron space that would be used. Culdrose along similar lines doesn't have much spare capacity for aircraft of the size of a P-8 - it can handle them, sure, but the base isn't built for them.

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