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New Targets at Spadeadam.

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johnhowe
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New Targets at Spadeadam.

Post by johnhowe » Tue Dec 04, 2012 11:08 pm

According to a news item in January Edition of The Railway Magazine one of the Pendolina Vehicles (68833) which was
derailed at Grayrigg has joined other railway stock to act as targets for aircrew training. A class 365 EMU that was involved in the Potters Bar crash on May the 10th 2002 which includes Two vehicles DMCO(B) Nos 65960 and TSO No 72990/72991 are also on the Range for target practise. Has anybody seen these particular targets?.
viewtopic.php?f=287&t=138137
Last edited by johnhowe on Mon Oct 24, 2016 9:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Chris Procter
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Re: New Targets at Spadeadam.

Post by Chris Procter » Wed Dec 05, 2012 8:32 am

The only trains I saw a couple of weeks ago was this and another one just like it
Image

No numbers on it that I can see but I presume this is not the one you mention

was nice meeting you up there
regards
Chris

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catkins
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Re: New Targets at Spadeadam.

Post by catkins » Wed Dec 05, 2012 10:13 am

I guess that carriage Chris could well be one of the Potters Bar carriages - I didn't really take in what the other carriages were, but its a bit sad and gory knowing now the history. I had assumed that they had been used for 'special' training ops but looking at your image and all the scrape marks, this all tends to fit with the possiblility of it being one of the carriages that John Howe mentions.
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catkins
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Re: New Targets at Spadeadam.

Post by catkins » Wed Dec 05, 2012 10:32 am

Bing Maps shows a collection of what look to be eight carriages at 55.027967, -2.604115 just to the north of the main buildings, which look as though they have just been delivered when this aerial image was taken. Present location of the majority unknown to me, with just a few carriages in this holding area at time of Chris P's photo. Google's imagery looks older.
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Sylar
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Re: New Targets at Spadeadam.

Post by Sylar » Tue Dec 18, 2012 12:49 pm

The eight carriages shown in bing maps look like London Underground stock, possibly 67 stock. Also in the above pic it looks like a Pendolino carriage is partly visible throught the window of the Networker. You can just make out part of the red/white swoosh as worn by the driving vehicles, but I thought that both of these are accounted for.

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michael1970
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Re: New Targets at Spadeadam.

Post by michael1970 » Tue Dec 18, 2012 8:56 pm

Guys these are not targets of any sort. They are used by a company that blows things up. Spade isnt just used by the RAF it hosts other companies that are none military for experimental purposes.

nickowen
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Re: New Targets at Spadeadam.

Post by nickowen » Wed Dec 19, 2012 8:21 pm

The HSE Explosion Laboratory occasionally uses Spadeadam for gas pipe and pressure vessel tests if the bang is likely to be too loud for the Harpur Hill site. If it's going to be a really big bang, the event will be NOTAMed.

johnhowe
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Re: New Targets at Spadeadam.

Post by johnhowe » Wed Dec 19, 2012 10:26 pm

michael1970 wrote:Guys these are not targets of any sort. They are used by a company that blows things up. Spade isnt just used by the RAF it hosts other companies that are none military for experimental purposes.
This is one of the leading companies that use Spadeadam, I have one of their Calendars with various explosions depicted.http://www.gl-nobledenton.com/en/consulting/813.php" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; Also click on large scale hazards


http://www.wreckhunters.be/spadeadam-ft10.html


https://www.directrailservices.com/performance/
Last edited by johnhowe on Mon Jul 24, 2017 6:09 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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PeteHemsley
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Re: New Targets at Spadeadam.

Post by PeteHemsley » Thu Dec 20, 2012 1:31 pm

I have to continue on from michaels comment. We have both seen what these carriages are used for and our last visit on station we caught a glimps of the carriages after "testing".

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RichC
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Re: New Targets at Spadeadam.

Post by RichC » Fri Dec 21, 2012 1:16 pm

I assume they are used for testing improvised devices on how they effect carriages in terms in a terrorist bomb? They did the same on aircraft of course.
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PeteHemsley
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Re: New Targets at Spadeadam.

Post by PeteHemsley » Sat Dec 22, 2012 10:11 am

Judging by the state of the trains, I'd say that's exactly what they are used for

michael1970
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Re: New Targets at Spadeadam.

Post by michael1970 » Sat Dec 22, 2012 10:48 am

A lad at my local camera club works at Spade and has been telling me some interesting stories about the site but here's a little bit about what they do.
Blast and High Explosive Testing
GL Noble Denton's Spadeadam Test Site
With qualified explosives engineers, GL Noble Denton has the facilities and expertise to carry out trials involving the use of high explosives for a wide variety of purposes.
Spadeadam Test Site has a capability to carry out tests with a net explosive quantity (NEQ) of up to 400kg TNT equivalent.

Typical explosive tests include use of shaped charges to cut through steel (e.g. to initiate catastrophic failures on pressurised pipes / vessels), testing of blast resistant materials and compounds to contact charges or at set distances, building components can be blast tested to a wide range of international standards including ISO/DIS 16933, ASTM F1642-04 and the US General Services Administration (GSA) Standards CEN/EXR.
GL Noble Denton offers the development of techniques using novel materials, such as Lytag, combined with steel and concrete to absorb the blast and fragments from explosive devices, proof testing of Litterbins to standards approved by the Police Scientific Development Branch, novel explosive devices or techniques or applications, disposal of explosive wastes and sympathetic detonation trials.

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RichC
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Re: New Targets at Spadeadam.

Post by RichC » Wed Jan 23, 2013 6:01 pm

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-21156908" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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catkins
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Re: New Targets at Spadeadam.

Post by catkins » Wed Jan 23, 2013 11:22 pm

Despite it being a Newcastle University project and that it involves train/metro carriages, I'm not sure if this testing has been at Spadeadam. The carriages are different to those seen at Spadeadam and the backdrop of the second view of the first carriage test looks too craggy for the normal test site for explosives. I think that it is likely to have been tested at the labs at Harpur Hill, Buxton. Interesting project, though with the indicated 'improved' containment of any explosion within the carriage I imagine that the internal affect on passengers might be increased?
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RichC
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Re: New Targets at Spadeadam.

Post by RichC » Thu Jan 24, 2013 10:50 am

Yeah the overpressure inside would certainly increase. Kind of with you on this, as in any explosion, the idea is to divert the explosion away from people. For instance in a tank, the ammo store has blast resistant doors for the crew but on the other side, the blast can rip through a dedicated area (upwards ) to limit the internal explosion to the crew.
I would have thought letting the explosion rip the train apart would be far more safer for those inside than keeping it contained.

But then it can work the other way, if in a tunnel or near built up areas, lots of collateral damage can occur if not contained. Can't win, catch 22. Save those inside or save those outside (buildings, tunnels, people).
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nickowen
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Re: New Targets at Spadeadam.

Post by nickowen » Sun Aug 10, 2014 3:48 pm

Saw this NOTAM which reminded me of this thread from last year:
nickowen wrote:The HSE Explosion Laboratory occasionally uses Spadeadam for gas pipe and pressure vessel tests if the bang is likely to be too loud for the Harpur Hill site. If it's going to be a really big bang, the event will be NOTAMed.
REF: H3650/14 QCode: WSLW From: 2014-Aug-23 Sat 08:00 To: 2014-Aug-25 Mon 18:00
Schedule: 0800-1800
ICAO: EGTT SFC to 35000FT AMSL
LARGE SCALE RELEASE AND IGNITION OF NATURAL GAS WI 2NM RADIUS 550245N 0023558W (SPADEADAM). FIREBALL UP TO 3500FT AMSL. HOT GASES UP TO 35000FT AMSL. OPS CTC 01697 747404. 14-08-0157/AS4

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