The whole chair, fence, chain issue

[Timbo69]

I've been going to RIAT for a few years now and after a walk around the statics the trip to the flight line is met with a wall of unoccupied chairs chained to the fence. What is the official ruling on this...my thinking is if it's allowed then we will make a beeline for a spot and chain our chairs up.

Many thanks.

TIm

[mark.alan.barnes]

I thought that the ruling was that people were not supposed to leave bags/chairs etc due to security concerns?

[TankBuster]

This has been going on at airshows for years, I remember back in the Air Fete days at Mildenhall the crowdline was always littered with chairs, windbreaks & fishing umbrellas or parasols.

It was often done by groups of families who constructed their own little enclosures, usually to ensure that they could enjoy the day in comfort (my parents always used to do it when we were kids). As was often the case though, if you didn't put up a wind break you would often end up with people pushing through you to get to the fence!
I witnessed a good example of 'fence rage' at Duxford many years ago where a photographer barged in between two chairs with people sitting in them in order to push his way through to the fence. One of the chaps in the chairs absolutely flipped his lid and how the photographer never ended up with that lens up his @rse I'll never know .

I personally don't think there's anything wrong with bagging a spot by the fence, after all its often why people leave home so early, just to increase their chances of getting a decent spot by the fence for the enjoyable day ahead.
However, in this day and age it probably isn't a good idea to leave anything unattended, we always used to make sure that someone stayed with our stuff & we often took it in turns to wander off for a look around the static displays.


TankBuster

[deerhunter]

Depends whether it was a canon or nikon fitting on his @rse

[Sparts99]

Agree wrth Tankbuster, you shouldn't leave anything unattended. Normally I go to displays on my own, if I'm bothered about being at the front I make sure I have food and drink and get there early and stay there. You can't chain a chair to a fence, walk off and expect there to be a spot for you hours later when the flying starts. If I'm with someone then one of us stays at our space and keeps an eye on bags etc if anyone wants to have a wander, or go to the toilet.

[Skoshi]

i'll pack my cutters, tough luck if its your seat.... similar issues used to happen with our "continental" cousins who used to try and bully people to move while graphing at MLD shows.

[jem60]

Sparts has got it. At Duxford, especially with Flying Legends, there are a number of foreign spectators who turn up on a Thursday, chain their chairs to the fence, and they are there all week-end. HOWEVER on Thursday and Friday, it is not crowded at all there, but if those chairs are still chained to the fence on Friday evening, then I can assure you that a friendly manager that I know at Duxford [no names!] will be along with his bolt cutters when the airfield locks up for the night!.
I remember at Fairford arrivals once, some bad mannered guy tried to push his way through those of us who arrived early, maintaining our positions. He really was obnoxious, but unfortunately he stood next to me. Just as he was about to press the button, I always seemed to bump into him, as did the guy on the other side. He didn't stay there long!!!.

[Blackcat1]

Nice1 Jem!! Yeah have come across many rude and obnoxious people at airshows , acting as if they own the airfield!!!

[mark.alan.barnes]

The only time I have suffered from 'encroachment' was at Yeovilton last year. I wouldn't mind but I was quite a distance from the fence.

We had deliberately set up quite a bit back to give us some room (we were also handily near the toilets, ice cream, etc.

Almost unbelievably I actually had someone elses chair overlapping my own. I put a can in the cup holder!!!

[C24]

Depends whether it was a canon or nikon fitting on his @rse

I really shouldn't encourage you but it would probably be...

[andrew b]

I think that if it's a fold up chair I would collapse it and say the riat team deemed it inappropriate ,failing that I would mention it to a team member , I find it so annoying that these people think they can do what they like and ruin it for everyone else in fact I myself will contact riat today and see what they can do , if I come across anyone doing it I will put the chair where the sun don't shine , it's not on not fair and really really makes my blood boil wish I could swear on here , anyway rant over for now and if I here anything from riat I will post here for all to see .other than that please enjoy what's looking to be another awesome, year let's pray the weather plays ball.

[andrew b]

reply from riat today hope it helps out
Thank you for your enquiry Andrew.



I have spoken to our operations director who has said that he has not yet come across this specific issue in the years that he has been at the show.



He explained that he would not recommend that anybody removes the chairs as this may cause direct confrontation with the owner. However, our visitor information guide states that: The erection of tents, gazebos, windbreaks and ladders on the showground can block the view of others. These are prohibited within 10 metres of the crowdline.



If you would like to bring it to the attention of the Sector Marshals (they wear hi-viz vests and ride around the showground on bicycles) then they will be equipped to deal with the issue, especially if anything contravenes the above rule.



I do hope that helps and we look forward to having you at the show.



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[powerslave]

He explained that he would not recommend that anybody removes the chairs as this may cause direct confrontation with the owner. However, our visitor information guide states that: The erection of tents, gazebos, windbreaks and ladders on the showground can block the view of others. These are prohibited within 10 metres of the crowdline.



If you would like to bring it to the attention of the Sector Marshals (they wear hi-viz vests and ride around the showground on bicycles) then they will be equipped to deal with the issue, especially if anything contravenes the above rule.

The crowdline at RIAT is full of fold up chairs,a fair few windbreaks and stuff right upto the fenceline.
I have never ever seen anyone being asked to take them down by any so called sector marshall.
If i want to get to the crowd line to get a shot and anyone with a crappy fold up chair is gonna have a go at me because he thinks its his space,well he can go and do one.

Ian

[mark.alan.barnes]

I've seen several tents taken down on the Red Section. When you consider that the sign informing people to not erect structures is probably 5-6 metres away from the fence, I never witnessed a disagreement either!

Give an inch and take a mile.

[Goosebumps]

I accept that some families want to set up Home and make themselves as wide as possible. Especially when they have young children who want to be shielded by the sun. My only issue is that when I stand behind them with my droooopy lens they always insist on making themselves as tall as possible. After all if you are at the front do you really need to stand as well
Just a thought

[Dan M]

If you want space on the crowd line, get up earlier. Simples.

[Nighthawke]

Well said Dan M.

Socially accepted at any public event that if you get to the front line first it is "your" spot. Why should someone expect to "barge through" to oust someone already there. Just like queue jumping really - if you don't like it done to you then why should you expect to do it yourself?

I haven't been to an airshow for years but it seems as if the same rudeness and lack of mutual respect still exists. I have great sympathy too for those trying too who are trying to "marshall". Did it for several years at Mildenhall and some people just did not respect the lines or the authority of us who were trying to keep order and fair for all.

It really gets me when parents shove their kids through telling them to push people out of the way. What sort of an example does that set.

Society soap box away...!

To those who force their way through to get "that" shot I hope you think it's worth it

[grogresaurus77]

Like last year, I'll be going 5 days on the trot Wednesday to Sunday, whilst getting up at 4am each day in the process. We got a spot on the crowdline each day, 2+2=4. There were a few who thought they could turn up and push in to the front, but those Tha did soon realised this wasn't possible, some of the little silent tantrums they had as they walked away were quite funny bless 'em.

[POL]

There's a ruddy big difference between being the first there so getting a spot at the front, which is perfectly acceptable, and getting there first, setting up a windbreak to cordon off 6ft of fence, and then sit there on your own all day!

[romeo bravo]

and getting there first, setting up a windbreak to cordon off 6ft of fence, and then sit there on your own all day!

Or disappearing for hours to look around the static display, only coming back to eat/drink and take a few photos.......