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MoD rule out A400M Atlas in flight refuelling

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TS010
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Re: MoD rule out A400M Atlas in flight refuelling

Post by TS010 » Mon Nov 13, 2017 1:18 pm


wezgulf3
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Re: MoD rule out A400M Atlas in flight refuelling

Post by wezgulf3 » Tue Nov 14, 2017 12:02 am

Seafire 47 wrote:Makes you wonder how many MP's are Airtanker shareholders.

As if such a thing would happen :ninja:

Wes...
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ColintheCaterpillar
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Re: MoD rule out A400M Atlas in flight refuelling

Post by ColintheCaterpillar » Tue Nov 14, 2017 8:18 am

Andy_99 wrote:Never going to need AAR for those............
Where have we heard that before ? Ah I remember the Vulcan & then along came the Falklands conflict. (The remove AAR was way before my time)
That was different; the capability was removed and then needed to be reinstated. Helicopter AAR is a different skill and one that the UK armed forces haven't done. As such, there's no widespread experience to "tap into" (as there was in 1982) and it isn't really comparable. The risk is doing it probably wildly outweighs the benefits too. Doing it over the Bristol Channel in benign conditions is massively different to a circumstance where you had to do it for operational reasons.

Supra
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Re: MoD rule out A400M Atlas in flight refuelling

Post by Supra » Tue Nov 14, 2017 11:12 am

[quote= Helicopter AAR is a different skill and one that the UK armed forces haven't done.........The risk is doing it probably wildly outweighs the benefits too. Doing it over the Bristol Channel in benign conditions is massively different to a circumstance where you had to do it for operational reasons.[/quote]Edited from above.

Guess it takes a couple of essential things for UK. helicopter AAR eh?
1] A UK. AAR refueler capable of flying at compatible airspeed?
2] Helicopter crew currency in performing 'wet contacts' as required? (one day I'm sure!)
3] The will to add that facility to the CHF. After all, we already train daily for many other unlikely scenarios?
I'm fairly sure in my mind that even a small UK. Helicopter component able to respond to as yet unknown range-limited situations would be a beneficial asset. I'm sure the HH-60 Combat SAR helicopters at LN serve some useful purpose? Why else would the US. bother to have probe-equipped helicopters?
From Wiki...The 56th Rescue Squadron (LN) is a combat-ready search and rescue squadron of HH-60G Pave Hawk helicopters capable of executing all-weather search and rescue missions day or night in hostile environments in support of USAFE, USEUCOM, and NATO operations. It employs a state-of-the-art communications and navigation system along with advanced search and rescue equipment. The squadron is capable of deploying to any theater of operations in the world.
Anybody know if there's a couple of C-130 tankers kicking around at Cambridge? I'm thinking of forming 'Omicron Air Refueling' just to stick two fingers-up to Airtanker for leaving a hole in their Contract. :Oops:

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Re: MoD rule out A400M Atlas in flight refuelling

Post by page_verify » Wed Nov 15, 2017 8:02 am

Supra, From your post I’m guessing you’re involved in the UK’s CHF helicopter force. What’s your world’s view on the need for this?

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Freeman Lowell
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Re: MoD rule out A400M Atlas in flight refuelling

Post by Freeman Lowell » Mon Mar 12, 2018 9:53 pm

Bob,
Did your enquiries lead anywhere? As Joe Spares wrote, there was a second (ZJ135/T) Merlin similarly plumbed at Marham in April 2002.
Would the current work be connected with any potential COD conversion of potentially surplus HC4s, however counter intuitive that might sound?
Freeman

turmo
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Re: MoD rule out A400M Atlas in flight refuelling

Post by turmo » Thu Mar 15, 2018 10:45 am

ColintheCaterpillar wrote:Doing it over the Bristol Channel in benign conditions is massively different to a circumstance where you had to do it for operational reasons.
Well it's a good enough place for USAF CV-22s to practice hook-ups, though pedantically they operate a bit farther out towards the IOM.

I don't understand the negativity here. For once we have the MoD demonstrating some foresight and specifying provision-for-not-with, somehow getting that through the budgeting rounds, and people are piling on saying 'what a waste of money, we don't do rotary AAR'.

We don't do ground strafing either, as a rule, but the Typhoons finally got a cannon.

Plan for the next war etc

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toom317
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Re: MoD rule out A400M Atlas in flight refuelling

Post by toom317 » Thu Mar 15, 2018 2:13 pm

turmo wrote:We don't do ground strafing either, as a rule, but the Typhoons finally got a cannon.
The Typhoon always had a cannon. They were going to remove it, but problems replacing it with dead weight, meant they decided to keep it fitted as originally designed. That doesn't mean they actually use it though.
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